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351c won't idle

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Waltman7777 View Drop Down
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    Posted: 03-August-2017 at 6:27AM
Hello my name is Walter. I'm newer to working on cars about a years experience. I just got a project car from an older gentleman who this car was his life but he went blind and had no use for it anymore. I promised to take care of it and ride it to him when I'm finished and go tear up some tire. I have the 351c 2v in it he gave me 4v heads with bigger valves ( but still 2 valves because apparently back then 4v meant the intake manifold had 4 barrels.. idk ). I got a Edelbrock 351 torker intake for it and gasket below and about the valley pan and got my vacuum all set up with the demon carb I put on. It won't idle no matter how I set the carb. Granted I didn't get too into setting the carb because I don't know much about Holly based carbs but I had a buddy come help me who did. The car seems like it has something else going on. I drove it down the road and got it to idle a little with a faster idle speed (SHOULDNT HAVE DONE). I realised my car was rediculously smoking and I stop to open the hood and oil was everywhere and the oil caught fire on my right exhaust manifold I put it out and got it back. I didn't hook up the kickdown right apparently and the car wouldn't shift very right it'd get really high in the rpms. My gauge is broke but I could hear it obviously. The guy told me the tranny was good so I obviously have a couple of problems. It's leaking near the timing chain cover or so. Its a decently fast leak that happens only when it's accelerated so idk I was thinking maybe the timing I went to loosen the bolt and turn the distributor in advance and it's seized to the block so I left it sit blasted with penetrating oil. I haven't messed with it since trying to study up because I've only owned Chevy's before hand. My boss introduced me to the Ford life. Honestly I like whatever, but Ford's seem to be built better just seems like parts are more harder to come by and more expensive. If anyone can help me I'd appreciate it so much.
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Don V. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Don V. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-August-2017 at 10:06AM
I've just started to work on this era cars again after years away from them. I say that because I'm sure better information will be coming. I can say this though, idling issues often come down to an issue with vacuum, timing or the carburetor. Severe problems aside, I'd start looking in to it in this order. Following vacuum lines is much less involved then rebuilding a carburetor. You have to start somewhere when you don't know what you're looking for. Good luck. 
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Big Bird View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Big Bird Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-August-2017 at 11:13AM
Is the Edelbrock manifold for 2V or 4V heads? It makes a difference.
The above post should be read in a "Grumpy Old Man" voice.
Almost forgot: "Get off my lawn!!!"
Randy
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californiajohnny View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote californiajohnny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-August-2017 at 11:35AM
Sounds like a vacuum leak. Also check the hose on the vacuum modulator at the rear of the tranny if it is off it wont shift and could be part of your vacuum leak problem, also check it on the other end at the manifold too
JOHN
74 GRAN TORINO S&H CLONE
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90 S10 BLAZER 4X4 LIFTED
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote russosborne Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-August-2017 at 1:58PM
Originally posted by Big Bird Big Bird wrote:

Is the Edelbrock manifold for 2V or 4V heads? It makes a difference.


This for starters. The 2v and 4v are not bolt on swapable. And yes, on these cars/years the V stands for Venturi (V= to carb barrel) 2V = 2barrels, 4V = 4barrels. There WILL be leaks if you try.
For the 2V heads you need 2V intake, 4V  heads means 4V intake. To put a 4barrel carb on a 2V engine you will need an aftermarket intake (with the possible exception of Australian Ford stuff, not sure) that is made for the 2V heads. Does your intake say 2V or 4V on it?

Edit to add I just did a quick search, it looks like the Torker is only for the 4V, but like I said I just did a quick search. The Performer series intake tends to be better for more stockish street engines, and I know for a fact that Edelbrock makes them for the 2V ( I have one sitting in the workroom waiting to go on my 72 Ranchero with the 351C 2V.)

Just fyi, if you decide to change exhaust manifolds or go with headers it is the same issue. With 2V heads you need manifolds/headers for the 2V. 4V for 4V. They can be made to work sort of, but better to stick with same for same.

Did the car run like this before you swapped intakes/carb?

Russ


Edited by russosborne - 03-August-2017 at 2:10PM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote russosborne Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-August-2017 at 2:14PM
Also wanted to add but tired of editing Wink that there are two types of 4V heads. Open and closed chamber. Open gives less compression, closed has higher.
There is an easy way of telling them apart since you have them off the engine, but darned if I remember exactly. It is how the chamber is shaped, should be able to do a quick search on that if you are interested. I have to run get food for my wife so don't have the time.

And possibly most important question. What car is all this in?

Russ
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rockatansky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-August-2017 at 4:33PM
in 1973 (D3xx castings) the 4V open chamber heads came with the smaller 2V valves in them
 
Torker is a pretty serious performance intake & i wouldn't recommend using it on a stock engine and without at least a 3.7, or even a 4.1 rear gear.
the Torker wants to turn rpm!
 
actually, most if not all 4V intakes will seal on 2V heads and you'll see power gains but it's not an ideal situation. it was done back in the day before the aftermarket responded and then when the 'take off' cast iron 4V intakes became available from the guys that swapped on a new alloy manifold. sealing problems pop up when 2V intakes are used on 4V heads
 
what heads are on the car, 2V or the small valve 4V's?


Edited by Rockatansky - 04-August-2017 at 4:34PM
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Waltman7777 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Waltman7777 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-August-2017 at 1:50AM
It has the 2v heads but I have the 4v heads to out in with the bigger valves. I was planning on swapping the cam and everything when I did the heads but the f**king distributor is Stuck in the engine and won't move. It's always something. I tried soaking it in penetrating oil for weeks and nothing. A prybar won't even budge it I'm afraid if anything else. Id imagine that's more than corrosion... Guy told me he had it out just fine. Maybe he beat it back in there for out a Chevy 350 distributor in or some sh*t I'm not certain... Getting really fed up and I really like this car. I wanna give this Ford a good chance
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Waltman7777 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Waltman7777 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-August-2017 at 1:56AM
The cars a 73 Gran Torino. With the 351c. It ran like sh*t before I didn't anything either but it'd shift.. the guy I got it from didn't gasket the valley pan to the intake and it was sucking air to all the valves lol... He also had a a non tuned carb from another car just threw it on. Thing leaked and was garbage. I'm surprised I made it home. But now the car won't idle. I hooked up all my vacuum. Tried adjusting this Holly demon carb on it ( I'm starting to think it's junk ). And from here on I don't really know I was thinking timing and figured out the distributor is stuck in my damn motor harder than a rigger in a hookers ass coming back from a 2 month job.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Waltman7777 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-August-2017 at 2:00AM
I have another intake manifold that's an older cast iron 4 barrel intake for the 351c that's dual plane should I try it? It has bolts snapped out in 3 of 4 the carb bolt holes. Some jackass obviously didn't try to get them out delicately. I got the one out that wasn't snapped with a little hear from a torch and some water and penetrating oil. The other ones are snapped off flush or just barely inside.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Waltman7777 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-August-2017 at 9:10AM
Going tomorrow to buy a 351w and drop it in this car and try to fix the original
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Waltman7777 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Waltman7777 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-August-2017 at 1:11PM
Guy with the motor ended up bailing.. hmm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rockatansky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-August-2017 at 3:52PM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Big Bird Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-August-2017 at 11:29PM
THIS will get that distributor out!!!!
The above post should be read in a "Grumpy Old Man" voice.
Almost forgot: "Get off my lawn!!!"
Randy
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rockatansky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-August-2017 at 12:03AM
they do get stuck!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote californiajohnny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-August-2017 at 3:09AM
a little heat and PB blaster Wink
JOHN
74 GRAN TORINO S&H CLONE
74 CORVETTE COUPE CUSTOM
90 S10 BLAZER 4X4 LIFTED
77 CELICA CUSTOM
75 V8 MONZA SUPERCHARGED
79 COURIER VERT. SLAMMED
75 VEGA V6 5 SPD
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Waltman7777 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-August-2017 at 7:42AM
I'll try that
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rockatansky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-August-2017 at 10:21AM
there's an O ring just below the flange, if it's got electrolysis corrosion it's stuck below the O ring so any lube will have a hard time getting to it
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Big Bird Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-August-2017 at 10:48AM
Don't go nuts with a pipe wrench. The body of the distributor WILL break off.
(Something I wish I didn't learn the hard way....)
The above post should be read in a "Grumpy Old Man" voice.
Almost forgot: "Get off my lawn!!!"
Randy
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