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71 Ranchero Radiator Help. Spewing everywhere

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Don V. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Don V. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 7:26AM
No timing marks? Doesn't the 302 from this era have the pointer cast right into the timing cover? If so it suggests something has been changed and may not be right.
 
I agree with John. If the thermostat is opening and coolant is coming out the cap, coolant isn't getting through the radiator. The 2 options are the radiator flow is blocked or restricted or for some reason the pump is impeding coolant flow. The radiator is the most obvious suspect.
 
The engine may well have blockages but I don't think the engine is your problem unless there is a problem with a head or the block. Your description suggests this happens to fast for an overheating issue specially with the heater bypassed.
 
I was told to asked you about this. Does your car have AC? If it does it should have come with a flex fan and no shroud. The flex fan had issues with throwing blades and no shroud had it's own problems. It was common for people at the time to try their own remedies that were commonly failures. The wrong fan blades and too big or too small spacers were often used. I can't tell you anymore then this but if you have questions I can find out but I don't think this is your problem. Your issues again, happen too fast for this.
 
Forgot this, make sure your head gaskets aren't on backwards. You should be able to see this, square in the front, something else in the back, sorry forgot what. Apparently this is common. 


Edited by Don V. - 17-July-2017 at 7:39AM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jordanbrown123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 10:05AM
Yea maybe i cant see the timing marks well enough, It is pretty rusty. 

No AC. 

Im going to take off the rad and pump and see just what the hell is going on. 

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dave302 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 10:53AM
In order for the other members to figure out what year your engine is, you can look at the casting number on the intake manifold. And while it might be possible that ithe ntake manifold might have been changed on your engine at some time. This is a good way to find out a possible year for your engine.
 
There also might be a casting number for your engine block down near the starter motor or in the upper rear/back of the engine block near the cylinder head.
 
The casting number might say E7TE-8425-A or D1TE-8425-A or D3TE-8425-A or another number.


Edited by dave302 - 17-July-2017 at 11:06AM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dave302 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 10:54AM
The yellow arrow in the picture below points to the casting number.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dave302 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 10:55AM
The casting number is in the picture below.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jordanbrown123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 11:06AM
Thanks but ive actually got an aftermarket edelbrock intake. Ill look for a cast number on the block. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Big Bird Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 12:37PM
Pointer should bolt on. Pointer has to match the balancer. There are 10 o'clock and 11 o'clock pointers...
Mine is FUBAR and gets timed by ear.
Oh, some of the older ones are on the driver side...
Can't be consistent...
The above post should be read in a "Grumpy Old Man" voice.
Almost forgot: "Get off my lawn!!!"
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jordanbrown123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 12:38PM
So today i went and got a new rad cap, hoping this was the problem. I jacked the front end up and filled it up with coolant to the cold line. Started the car up and let it warm up with the cap off. No issues/bubbles/spraying out... untill the thermostat opened up. then all hell broke loose lol. Just started pouring out the rad. So i slapped on the new rad cap and within 1 min the cap opened up and it let the water out. About half of the radiator worth.... The water wasnt even very hot coming out. No steam or anything. 

Time to tear this thing apart i say.. New rad and water pump is on my to do list now. 
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Don V. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Don V. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 1:35PM
Originally posted by Jordanbrown123 Jordanbrown123 wrote:

So today i went and got a new rad cap, hoping this was the problem. I jacked the front end up and filled it up with coolant to the cold line. Started the car up and let it warm up with the cap off. No issues/bubbles/spraying out... untill the thermostat opened up. then all hell broke loose lol. Just started pouring out the rad. So i slapped on the new rad cap and within 1 min the cap opened up and it let the water out. About half of the radiator worth.... The water wasnt even very hot coming out. No steam or anything. 

Time to tear this thing apart i say.. New rad and water pump is on my to do list now. 
 
Again, this suggests the radiator can't handle the flow created by the pump. Either the radiator has clogged tubes or it's flow rate is too low for the pump. Since you said there's a history of coolant problems I'd go with the problem being in the radiator. If you can get the casting numbers for the engine and heads this can be easily evaluated.
 
Do you know anyone with a radiator with a row or 2 more of tubes running through it that you can borrow? This may not identify blockage or flow being your problem but it may help to isolate the problem to the radiator or remove the radiator from the list of suspects. With the updated descriptions of your problems the potential for the off the wall possibilities seem less likely but doesn't eliminate them IMO.  


Edited by Don V. - 17-July-2017 at 1:37PM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jordanbrown123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 1:36PM
I cant for the life of me find the block stamping. Not with the motor in the car anyway... Is there any kind of visual differences between different 302 manufacturing years? 
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Don V. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Don V. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 1:49PM
The only thing I know of is 68-75 had "Powered by Ford" stamped in to the valve covers. I'm not sure of the years except late 60's, Ford made some 289's that you can only tell weren't 302's by the VIN, build sheet or taking the engine apart. Possibly someone else knows the story behind this better than I do. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dave302 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 2:12PM
The block casting number is right where tha starter bolts to the block at the transmission bellhousing. You will probably have to remove the starter to see it. The green arrow points to the casting number.


Edited by dave302 - 17-July-2017 at 2:26PM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dave302 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 2:13PM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dave302 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 2:15PM
To find the casting numbers on the cylinder heads you might have to remove them. They are on the underside of the cylinder head, on the intake side in between the pushrod holes. The yellow arrows point to the casting numbers.


Edited by dave302 - 17-July-2017 at 2:32PM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dave302 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 2:16PM
There is a picture below of the casting number.


Edited by dave302 - 17-July-2017 at 2:30PM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jordanbrown123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 3:11PM
Thanks for the info. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dave302 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-July-2017 at 3:18PM
Your welcome
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jordanbrown123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-July-2017 at 12:53PM
Been soaking the radiator in vinegar and drano trying to get stuff out. I think some did come out. But heres a video on what exactly is happening. 



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Don V. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-July-2017 at 5:29AM
The location of your fan and shroud is wrong but your fan? You can see the outline of it running. Usually on a fan, the blade taper is in the direction of air flow. If your fan is typical then you are trying to push air back into the radiator which is backwards. Look at the top of the profile of your moving fan in your video. It should be pulling air through the radiator. It's possible I suppose that ford just turned the fan blades for CW and CCW pumps and you have just the CCW fan on a CW pump. 
 
 
Your fan should also be much closer to you radiator. That's a spacer problem. My understanding is that without AC and with a shroud the fan should be completely inside the shroud.
 
I'd also ditch the vinegar. Drain the radiator and start boiling water. Use your biggest pots and refill a cold radiator.
 
Your flywheel and pump pulley's should be darn near the same size. It could be the side view optics, but I don't see that in the video. If your motor is physically incapable of accepting the pumps rate it usually results in cavitation. This would not be the typical scenario for cavitation but when high and low pressures are opposite of flow cavitation results.  
 
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jordanbrown123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-July-2017 at 8:11AM
I see. The taper points towards the engine so its pulling air thru the radiator and over the motor. As for the fan it could be pushed forward a little more. But thats the least of my worries right now. 

Now that you mention it the pulley for the waterpump does look a little bigger than the inner pulley on the crank. But its hard to see. 
Id post a photo on here but im not sure how exactly. 


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote californiajohnny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-July-2017 at 9:44AM
the fan to shroud didn't look too bad, half of the blade pitch should be at the edge of the shroud ideally, the surging up is normal for the first time filling the system before the thermostat opens and all the air pockets are out... but that sudden geyser Shocked WTF??? ShockedShockedShocked
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dave302 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-July-2017 at 9:52AM
Is that a high volume/high flow water pump that is installed on your engine? It might not make any difference, but it might help the other members solve your problem if they know about it. Some water pumps have a part number on them. If yours has a part number you can write it here.
 
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dave302 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-July-2017 at 9:53AM
To post a picture, you will have to first download the pictures to your phone or computer and put them into a folder such as "your pictures".
 
Next you will have to click the post reply button at the bottom left of this post. Do not use the "quick reply" window/option at the extreme bottom of the screen to post pictures. Because it does not have an insert image button.


Edited by dave302 - 23-July-2017 at 10:01AM
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Next, you will have to click the insert image button at the top of the post. The red circle below is the insert image button.
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Next, you will have to click the browse button to go to the "your pictures" folder to select the picture that you want to download to this site. The browse button is located at the bottom middle of the picture below. The browse button is named Tallozas in the picture below.
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When the picture loads up on the screen, such as in the bottom right side of the picture below, you will have to click the OK button on the bottom right side of the screen, to post the picture in this thread.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Big Bird Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-July-2017 at 1:15PM
Another odd thing, your radiator cap is on the suction side of the radiator, hose is at bottom and goes to water pump. Cant figure out your volcano issue. Water is going thru the radiator, but not back to the water pump. Serpentine belt fans are backward from v-belt fans, so using the wrong fan will push air back instead of pulling air thru the radiator.
The above post should be read in a "Grumpy Old Man" voice.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jordanbrown123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-July-2017 at 1:31PM
Thanks ill get the part number from the waterpump. Just taking it out today, 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Don V. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-July-2017 at 1:18AM
Jordan,
 
I understand that much of what I wrote has nothing to do with your immediate problems. It has more to do with your comment about the car history with cooling difficulties.
 
About the taper. Look at your video at 15 seconds. The see through blur of the of the running fan blades can be seen right at the top of the screen. The taper, getting smaller is towards the radiator. Typically the taper, a getting smaller profile is in the direction of air flow. I don't pretend to know a whole lot about these cars so what is typical for me may well mean nothing with your car but I would make sure.
 
I picked up George Reid's book on small block Ford's the other day and in it he writes about water pump casting numbers and states to be careful when using them. Apparently there are a fair number of companies the rebuild the pumps to specs that aren't consistent with the original to improve cooling. People do this to keep the original parts on the car while achieving the better specs of aftermarket options.
 
A last reminder, if your car has the plastic flex fan there should be no shroud per Ford, but some say it should anyway. I'm told Ford says no because the angle or pitch of the blades changes with the RPM's and the shroud screws with that. Your car has no air so as I understand it should have a shroud but if the fan came with the engine, who knows?


Edited by Don V. - 24-July-2017 at 1:19AM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jordanbrown123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-July-2017 at 7:51AM
There we go. Here are some pictures. If ya see somthing wrong pls let me know thanks/; 
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