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Clay View Drop Down
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    Posted: 16-June-2014 at 4:46AM
I'd like to lower the front end of my 72 Gran Torino to give it a more aggressive look. Nothing to crazy just maybe an inch or so less than stock... I've seen on Gas Monkey garage, where they just install different coil springs to do this. Is that all it takes ? if so
what amount would be a good amount to lower it & how do I order the correct springs for the job ?
All the sources I've seen just sell factory stock springs ?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote robot9000 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-June-2014 at 9:06AM
Couple of things to think about.

If you just want to lower the front, and you want to do it on the cheap, cut your current coils.

If you want new springs (and who doesn't really) you should put in 4 new ones because you will be fighting 40 year old sag.  Meaning, you can buy Eaton springs with 1 inch drop that will not look 1 inch dropped because your 2 inchish sagging rear springs are still there, lol.

I put in 1 inch drop Eatons in the front and it sits level. I plan to do stock Eatons in the back and that should give me a bit of The Look.

Some people don't go the Eaton route.  Some use the Moog's of differing varieties.  Search the threads, there is a crazy amount of info there.

Personally, I have been very happy with the Eatons, there is no guessing and they are not too expensive.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n2fordwagons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-June-2014 at 10:36AM
I would start off with cutting my springs, if I were you.  I did this on my 69 Cougar and '77 LTD II station wagon.  It seems like I cut 1 coil from them.  I wouldn't cut any more than that.  You could start with 1/2 a coil, then progress to a full coil if you want it lower.  I'll see if I can dig up before and after pics of the wagon.
 
If you were wanting a full drop (front and rear), I'd recommend going with Eaton springs.  But, since you're just wanting to drop the front, I'd just cut them. 
Jeff

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n2fordwagons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-June-2014 at 11:02AM
Before
 
 
After
 
 
After with new wheels
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rockatansky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-June-2014 at 2:16PM
IMO this is a situation that is sawzall approved

start with cutting off 1/4 coil & see if it's enough, you can cut another 1/4 or 'by the inch' if you want just a little more drop

side benefits of removing coils from the existing spring is you gain a slight amount of spring rate, meaning the spring is a little stronger... and a few minutes with the sawzall or even hacksaw is very co$t effective

Edited by Rockatansky - 16-June-2014 at 2:18PM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 72FordGTS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-June-2014 at 2:41PM
I'd also recommend cutting springs. If you factory springs are really rusty or saggy, it might be worth while to buy a new set first. Like Rockatansky suggested, cut in small sections, cause if you cut too much your spring is junk.

I trimmed about half a coil off my replacement springs (upgraded to far stiffer Moog springs) to get the stance I wanted. I used a grinder with a cut off wheel, cut through it quickly without too much heat. Just don't use a cutting torch.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Billy C Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-June-2014 at 2:59PM
what they said^

except...
Originally posted by Rockatansky Rockatansky wrote:

meaning the spring is a little stronger...
"stiffer" or "higher rate" is actually the appropriate term, strength of the spring is a slightly different thing.. but you get the point Wink... 

so ya.. what they said.. pull that sawzall/cutoff wheel out and have at it. I prefer the cutoff wheel myself. It makes light work of that spring steel.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote californiajohnny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-June-2014 at 4:11PM
i use a 4" makita grinder, i didn't think a sawzall would even cut that spring steel
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bdaugette Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-June-2014 at 1:45AM
I assume they cannot be cut while still on the car?  If not, how difficult is it to pull them out?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Clay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-June-2014 at 1:46AM
Well that's simple enough. I'll cut my old springs and see how it looks.

Thanks for the help !
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote unlovedford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-June-2014 at 2:43AM
Hmmm. Yes, a sawzall can cut springs. Get good blades and it'll cut everything but the cheese.
Joe
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n2fordwagons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-June-2014 at 3:00AM
Originally posted by bdaugette bdaugette wrote:

I assume they cannot be cut while still on the car?  If not, how difficult is it to pull them out?
 
Correct.  You'll have to take them out of the car.  To remove the springs, you should unbolt your lower ball joint, along with the sway bar, shock, and whatever else is connected to the lower control arm.  You'll need to have a jack under the arm before you start this process, then lower it slowly, so the spring doesn't pop out.  Or the safe method is to use a spring compressor before you lower the control arm.  Also, a spring compressor will make it easier to re-assemble.  You'll also need a tool that will safely pop the ball joint without tearing it up.  Especially if you think you'll want to remove the spring again to cut it some more (if the first cut doesn't drop it enough for your tastes).


Edited by n2fordwagons - 17-June-2014 at 3:03AM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bdaugette Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-June-2014 at 3:05AM
Thanks, I was going to replace the shocks anyway so this is a logical time to do it.  I am not sure of the age of the ball joints, so they may be replaced also.  I have read several places that 1/2 of a coil leaves a nice stance, without lowering it too far.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Billy C Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-June-2014 at 8:47AM
I did mine the first time around on the car. It was super sketchy and I don't recommend it.  I compressed the spring with the tool until all the load was off the last coil and got a cutoff wheel in there some how. Pinch Shocked  Some how I managed to twist the pig tail of the spring down into it's slot. again, KIDS, DO NOT TRY THIS AT HOME!!!! Seriously I would never do it again that way. It looks tempting but don't even bother. It is far easier to pull everything apart the right way. Since then I have been cut down to bone multiple times with a cutoff wheel, it could have been my face when I was doing the springs.

Edited by Billy C - 17-June-2014 at 8:50AM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Big Bird Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-June-2014 at 9:02AM
Originally posted by unlovedford unlovedford wrote:

Hmmm. Yes, a sawzall can cut springs. Get good blades and it'll cut everything but the cheese.

So says the master
"What we do in full frontal view, is more honest than your cleaned-up mind."
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote robot9000 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-June-2014 at 9:13AM
So, I'm kinda the outlier on this stuff, so take this with a grain of rusty quarter panel grit....

If you are going to take apart your front suspension, which while not overly complicated, is a fair amount of work (don't let anyone tell you different) on a 40+ year old car, why not replace those 40 year old components - springs, ball  joints, shocks, tie rod ends..

Just sayin....
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 72FordGTS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-June-2014 at 6:59AM
I see from another thread you are doing a full frame off restoration. If that is the case, I'd strongly consider upgrading the springs to new springs and replacing any worn front end hardware.  Keep in mind if your car has the base suspension, these springs were very soft and not great for handling.  The cars with HD suspension were better but competition springs handled best.  If you want to upgrade the handling, I'd recommend installing stiffer springs a larger sway bar especially if you have the base suspension.   There is a TON of info in our coil spring thread that may be helpful for deciding on your spring choice.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Clay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-June-2014 at 7:55AM
Yeah, I've rebuilt the front end with a kit from PST. I was going to cut my old springs put them back in and see how it looked, but I've decided instead to go with new Eaton springs that come with the 1" drop already. I just e-mailed Eaton this morning to see how much they're going to cost.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n2fordwagons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-June-2014 at 9:42AM
Originally posted by Clay Clay wrote:

Yeah, I've rebuilt the front end with a kit from PST. I was going to cut my old springs put them back in and see how it looked, but I've decided instead to go with new Eaton springs that come with the 1" drop already. I just e-mailed Eaton this morning to see how much they're going to cost.
 
The folks at Eaton told me my current, original (sagging) springs should make my car sit about 1" lower than the original ride height.  Therefore, they recommended 2" drop springs if I wanted a 1" drop from the existing ride height.  I hope to install them very soon, and can provide before and after pics and details.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Clay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-June-2014 at 2:00AM
I got the price back from Eaton. The springs are 200 bucks plus 40 for shipping.
Ouch !
I can buy OEM springs at my local auto parts store for 102 dollars ( per pair ) and no shipping expense.
I think I'll buy OEM springs and just cut 'em.
A good saws all blade is allot cheaper than the 138 dollar difference.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Robbdtme Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-June-2014 at 6:04AM
Not perfect but I recall years back I had bought a set of 4 ( 2 for each side ) Spring clamps, You install them on the springs then crank them tight and they lower it buy compressing the springs. Not a clue if they still make them.
Also engine size I recall made a difference. 429/460 had heavier springs over a 302
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote unlovedford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-June-2014 at 7:45AM
I would think putting a big block into a car with small block springs would lower it significantly. Not a great idea for handling, but it would achieve the desired look.
Joe
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BadHabit351 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-June-2014 at 9:02AM
Originally posted by Clay Clay wrote:

I got the price back from Eaton. The springs are 200 bucks plus 40 for shipping.
Ouch !
I can buy OEM springs at my local auto parts store for 102 dollars ( per pair ) and no shipping expense.
I think I'll buy OEM springs and just cut 'em.
A good saws all blade is allot cheaper than the 138 dollar difference.

Summit Racing has the CVPI springs for $72....make your order exceed $100 and get free shipping. Translation: get $30 worth of freebies for your $102
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BadHabit351 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-June-2014 at 9:05AM
Or OEM's for $67
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Clay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-June-2014 at 8:17AM
Great info... I'm going to Summit. My local auto parts store let me down. After giving me the lowest price around, I go to order them & then they come back with a higher price, I pulled out a copy of the quote I had received, then they scratched their head, looked disgusted and said " oh, it looks like they're not available anymore, we can't get them at all."
I have to call BS on that one... OEM coil springs for a Ford not available... ??? I think someone over there goofed up, gave me a discounted price & then didn't want to honor it.
oh well... blessing in disguise I guess.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 72FordGTS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-June-2014 at 9:21AM
FYI,
 
there are three aftermarket replacement springs for a 1972 Torino made by Moog:
 
8166 - 282 in/lbs
 
8302 - 318 in/lbs
 
8170 - 370 in/lbs
 
These are NOT the same as the OEM Ford springs, Ford had something like 12 front springs in 1972.  However, if you don't want your car to ride like a marshmallow, I'd probably go with the 8170's or at least the 8302s.  You'll definitely have to trim those springs to get a decent stance, probably a fair bit with a 351-2V (I bet more than one full coil), but at least with decent shocks and sway bars the car should handle fairly well.  Keep in mind cutting a spring will increase the spring rate slightly and most aftermarket springs out of the box seem to be taller than stock.  A coil spring is really just a curled up torsion bar and like a torsion bar shorter length effects the rate. 
 
The base suspensions on these Torinos were not very good for handling.  Competition suspension cars ran a 500+ in/lb  spring from the factory.  I run 710 in/lb springs with Bilstein shocks and a 1 1/8" bar, and in my opinion these cars need that much spring to be good handlers.


Edited by 72FordGTS - 23-June-2014 at 9:37AM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rockatansky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-June-2014 at 11:57AM
Moog 9046's are under $52 @ Rockauto, & it's easy to find a discount code too
 
check / call for your specific part number if it doesn't pull up in a search on their site
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 72FordGTS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-June-2014 at 3:07PM
Originally posted by Rockatansky Rockatansky wrote:

Moog 9046's are under $52 @ Rockauto, & it's easy to find a discount code too
 
check / call for your specific part number if it doesn't pull up in a search on their site
 
Good call on those springs, I forgot about them.  They are actually for a 1992-2002 Crown Vic, with standard suspension.  They are rated at 421 in/lbs, which is a big improvement over stock.  Plus you won't have to cut as much since they are shorter than all the other Torino springs.
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rockatansky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-June-2014 at 10:27AM
$56 at Summit, rolled into a free shipping deal that might be even better
 
I'm not sure more like have no idea what the rate would be after cutting to achieve
a desired stance but it could be get'n up there!
 
maybe not for everybody?
 
also don't forget that the shocks need to be up to the task of controlling a high rate spring Wink


Edited by Rockatansky - 24-June-2014 at 10:28AM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote robot9000 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-June-2014 at 12:17PM
How does cutting a spring increase its rate?  It doesn't change the material or the resistance to compress.  
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