Power steering box run dry - harmful? |
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unlovedford
Senior Member Joined: 17-December-2010 Location: Tennessee Status: Offline Points: 10142 |
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Posted: 15-July-2014 at 3:49PM |
Hey guys, have a quick question. Will it hurt a power steering box to be driven without lines or a pump? I am installing an old power steering box on Stripper to make the Louisville trip if I cannot get the brown wagon finished in time. Will it hurt the box to be driven on a trip like that? Steering effort with the 55 series tires is tough, but I don't mind. Just don't want an issue on the road or to ruin the box.
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Joe
1972 Mom's Squire Wagon 1972 Torino Wagon 1976 Torino 1968 Cougar XR7-First batch 1972 Torino 460 1989 BroncoII/Jeeps/Titanimous Popeye and Brutus (Rams) |
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aquartlow
Senior Member Joined: 19-December-2011 Location: Summerfield, Fl Status: Offline Points: 2270 |
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Obviously not a good idea to run it without PS fluid. Just remember the balls for the worm shaft are lubed with the fluid, if none exists, you could score the rack/piston/worm shaft and/or flat spot/score the ball bearings. When my mechanic rebuilt my PS box he advised me to never run a PS box dry due to causing internal damage to the torsion bar that is inside the input shaft of the PS gearbox, it could cause the vehicle to have a pull issue once fluid is re-introduced and power assist is regained. Here is a representation of the steering box's torsion bar: Too much twisting force, either way, will make the torsion shaft twist so much that it will not return to the center position. This causes PS assist in the direction the torsion bar is tweaked thus causing the pull that may be experienced. Once done a new PS gearbox is needed, or at least a new input rotary valve. Here is a pic of the torsion bar/shaft inside the input shaft on the PS gearbox, I realize it is a pic of a Saginaw box but a Ford gearbox is similar: I hope this helps. Todd
Edited by aquartlow - 15-July-2014 at 4:44PM |
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www.supermotors.net/22468
Yeah, It's a Hybrid...It burns gas and tires. No matter how good she looks, somebody, somewhere, is tired of her sh*t. Beauty is skin deep, ugliness goes clear to the bone. |
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unlovedford
Senior Member Joined: 17-December-2010 Location: Tennessee Status: Offline Points: 10142 |
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Thanks Todd. I was afraid of that.
Crap. This thing is giving me fits. |
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Joe
1972 Mom's Squire Wagon 1972 Torino Wagon 1976 Torino 1968 Cougar XR7-First batch 1972 Torino 460 1989 BroncoII/Jeeps/Titanimous Popeye and Brutus (Rams) |
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aquartlow
Senior Member Joined: 19-December-2011 Location: Summerfield, Fl Status: Offline Points: 2270 |
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Joe, You are more than welcome. When the mechanic showed and explained to me how the torsion bar operated and how it could be "off-centered" by operating the PS box without assist, it was an eye-opening and/or interesting lesson. He did show me what it took to fix it(if it wasn't too badly "tweaked"), but it would definitely require disassembly of the PS box. Sorry to be the barer of bad news, but I hope it helps in the long run. Todd
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www.supermotors.net/22468
Yeah, It's a Hybrid...It burns gas and tires. No matter how good she looks, somebody, somewhere, is tired of her sh*t. Beauty is skin deep, ugliness goes clear to the bone. |
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Big Bird
Senior Member Joined: 25-August-2013 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 4194 |
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I can't say it was good for the box, but I drove my 77 malibu with no P.S. pump for 2 1/2 years ( 60k+ miles). Steering box was full, and I ran a hose from one port to the other and clamped them so the fluid would circulate and not spill out. The car was inspected every year, and nobody ever said a word about it. I ran the car at the track, and didn't have a problem with tech. I drove the car from Rochester to Carlisle several times and took it to Buffalo at least weekly. It was a nuisance in tight parking lots (Power Oversteer time ) but once you were moving, no big deal. I broke the P.S. pump (gacked a hole in the side) while swapping in a Buick 350 in place of the GMC 292 that had been swapped in in place of the chevy 250 it came with.
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"What we do in full frontal view, is more honest than your cleaned-up mind."
Randy 1979 T-Bird 2005 F-150 STX RCSB 4.6, 3.55 LSD How the Heck does a REGULAR CAB SHORTBED weigh over 5200 pounds? |
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occupant
Senior Member Joined: 23-October-2006 Location: Lawton, OK Status: Offline Points: 1973 |
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When I had my '75 sedan back in Texas in 1996, I was driving back home from work when one of the PS lines ruptured and sent a cloud of smoke behind my car so thick no one could see through it. The pump was TRASHED by the time I got home 10 miles later. Still steered OK just no assist. Box didn't seem to be affected after putting the new pump and lines on.
I don't recommend it but you know what, I don't recommend running that manual box you were talking about with all that slop in it. |
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unlovedford
Senior Member Joined: 17-December-2010 Location: Tennessee Status: Offline Points: 10142 |
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Yes, the manual box is shot. My problem is that the current 250/3 speed drivetrain is going to be removed after the meet, so spending money for a new 250 PS bracket, pump, new lines just to do this trip seems incredibly wasteful. None of that will work on the V8 I'm installing, so it would just be another pile in the garage.
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Joe
1972 Mom's Squire Wagon 1972 Torino Wagon 1976 Torino 1968 Cougar XR7-First batch 1972 Torino 460 1989 BroncoII/Jeeps/Titanimous Popeye and Brutus (Rams) |
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Psquare75
Admin Group Member of the Stroker Club Joined: 26-November-2005 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 4591 |
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Can you fill the box and loop one line into the other? I've had friends who drove cars like this for YEARS back in the day.
I'd be more concerned about the PS pump than the box.
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Paul
77 XR7 460/C6/3.00:1 *SOLD* 78 XR7 523/C6/3.5:1 79 F100 460/TKO500/3.25:1 'I also have some left over potatoes-I understand you can generate electricity from them'- Foote500 |
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aquartlow
Senior Member Joined: 19-December-2011 Location: Summerfield, Fl Status: Offline Points: 2270 |
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If between a rock and hard place, drive it "as-is", the worst thing that could happen is having to replace the PS gearbox if found to be damaged. You will probably be "money ahead" (not having to purchase parts to complete the 250's PS system) since you are removing/replacing components after the show, a rebuilt unit w/ warranty can usually be had for under $150. Not sure how the rag joint will accept the increased steering effort though. Good luck and have fun at the show . Todd
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www.supermotors.net/22468
Yeah, It's a Hybrid...It burns gas and tires. No matter how good she looks, somebody, somewhere, is tired of her sh*t. Beauty is skin deep, ugliness goes clear to the bone. |
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