Electrical setup advice on rebuilt Cleveland |
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rrlcommish
Member Joined: 01-January-2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Status: Offline Points: 58 |
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Posted: 18-February-2018 at 11:30AM |
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Hi all,
Just had my 351C rebuilt. It was a stock 2V and I am upgrading to 4V. Cylinders are bored out, higher compression pistons, lumpier cam, etc. So I need to choose all new electrical. There are a dizzying array of distributors, plugs/wires, coils, etc. I am overwhelmed at the choices. I had a Pertonix Ignitor in the old 2V setup and performed well with no issues for many thousands of miles. So I am somewhat partial to them, though certainly not married. What does everyone recommend as far as choosing what setup setup to use? What all components do I need and should I stick with one brand? Or better to mix and match? Any and all advice welcome, I'm very open-minded here, and have much to learn! Thanks!
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1972 Gran Torino Sport Fastback, Bored 30-over 351C - 4V, Lt Blue, Pertronix Ignitor, dual exhaust with Turbo mufflers, otherwise stock
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Rockatansky
Senior Member Joined: 30-July-2010 Location: On The Road Status: Offline Points: 6072 |
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any reason to not re-use the Pertronix?
seems like it'd be a nobrainer since the car is wired and you know it works |
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72 GT Ute
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rrlcommish
Member Joined: 01-January-2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Status: Offline Points: 58 |
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I would think I'd want to upgrade/replace my old distributor, coil, plugs, wires, etc...no? I wouldn't want to re-use that stuff, it's many years old and has many miles on it. Plus the engine has received a significant horsepower upgrade. Not sure if that matters, I would think it does.
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1972 Gran Torino Sport Fastback, Bored 30-over 351C - 4V, Lt Blue, Pertronix Ignitor, dual exhaust with Turbo mufflers, otherwise stock
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72GTS351CJ
Senior Member Joined: 30-November-2010 Location: NY Status: Offline Points: 1481 |
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I had my 351c built to a 393 ...As per the engine builder he recommended msd 6a box with 8577 msd distributor 4 years past and still very happy. -Rick-
Edited by 72GTS351CJ - 19-February-2018 at 3:39AM |
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72GTS Clint Eastwood Special
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7T9_Tbird
Senior Member Joined: 04-December-2017 Location: Athens, Alabama Status: Offline Points: 495 |
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I have a MSD distributor and 6AL box, Very happy with it. I've also run the DUI setup on My 351W, don't know if they have them for the 351C, but they work well also, and very easy to hook up.
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John
79 Thunderbird Heritage 79 Thunderbird Town Landau 02 Ram 1500 Sport Quad Cab |
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72FordGTS
Admin Group GTS.org Admin Joined: 06-September-2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Status: Offline Points: 5846 |
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You can run a MSD box with a pertronix if you wanted to, and reused your old distributor. Just check the bushings for free play.
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Vince
1972 Ford GTS Sportsroof - Survivor, One Family car GTS.org Admin |
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Rockatansky
Senior Member Joined: 30-July-2010 Location: On The Road Status: Offline Points: 6072 |
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i'd worry more about the location of the gear on the shaft and the required free play for it 1 major reason i'd stick with a known good / working piece that you already own is because the aftermarket can't get the gear on the shaft in the right place and new out of the box distributors are chewing new cam gears faster than FWIW i don't know how much more upgraded you're gonna get? unless you go to a multi coil on plug type ignition ... i'd keep it simple one consideration is can you get parts at Walmart? goal for stock Duraspark whatever you decide on, check for oil clearance / free play travel between the bottom of the dizzy gear and the block ledge before you install the timing set. the dizzy hold down bolt needs to be snugged tight as it would be while driving or the O ring will hold the dizzy up and fake clearance i just remembered Tim Meyer / Trackboss products is working on a stock appearing dizzy that uses a GM module inside, again goal for availability anywhere. can also be used with a multi spark box Edited by Rockatansky - 19-February-2018 at 9:40AM |
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72 GT Ute
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Big Bird
Senior Member Joined: 25-August-2013 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 4194 |
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Some of the replacement Duraspark boxes actually have a G.M. HEI module inside instead of the Fork guts.
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"What we do in full frontal view, is more honest than your cleaned-up mind."
Randy 1979 T-Bird 2005 F-150 STX RCSB 4.6, 3.55 LSD How the Heck does a REGULAR CAB SHORTBED weigh over 5200 pounds? |
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Rockatansky
Senior Member Joined: 30-July-2010 Location: On The Road Status: Offline Points: 6072 |
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and some offshore spark boxes are multi-nothing but a GM module inside
probably a defective one at that Edited by Rockatansky - 19-February-2018 at 11:34AM |
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72 GT Ute
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Rockatansky
Senior Member Joined: 30-July-2010 Location: On The Road Status: Offline Points: 6072 |
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only place i could find info
https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/1442117-track-boss-ready-to-run-duraspark-distributor.html |
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72 GT Ute
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72FordGTS
Admin Group GTS.org Admin Joined: 06-September-2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Status: Offline Points: 5846 |
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This is what I want for my car. However, Tim hasn't given me a clear answer on when or if they will be ready any time soon. If one is ready by the end of my build, I am going to get one. The GM HEI modules are a dime a dozen, and cheap enough to carry spares. Otherwise, I am probably going to go with a home made Duraspark HEI setup like Todd did on his car.
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Vince
1972 Ford GTS Sportsroof - Survivor, One Family car GTS.org Admin |
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Rockatansky
Senior Member Joined: 30-July-2010 Location: On The Road Status: Offline Points: 6072 |
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it does seem like the dizzy is on the back burner, minimum. Tim's web page is scrubbed of public access to any of the posts about it and my post in the 335 section goes to his 'private' message
but yeah the quality GM modules last a darn long time too! for my hundreds of $ personally i don't need a family keepsake dizzy housing, a factory housing can be polished up pretty spiffy and sealed in clear FTW https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/217131-well-i-did-the-gm-module-duraspark-ii-distributor-tfi-coil-conversion-long-post.html Edited by Rockatansky - 19-February-2018 at 2:04PM |
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72 GT Ute
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7T9_Tbird
Senior Member Joined: 04-December-2017 Location: Athens, Alabama Status: Offline Points: 495 |
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Since your leaning towards the GM HEI, here's the one I run on my '79 t-bird, but for the 351c;
They're great setups, mine works with the factory tach, and they're just about drop-in. I incorrectly called mine the DUI setup, which is WAY more expensive.
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John
79 Thunderbird Heritage 79 Thunderbird Town Landau 02 Ram 1500 Sport Quad Cab |
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Rockatansky
Senior Member Joined: 30-July-2010 Location: On The Road Status: Offline Points: 6072 |
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pretty sure it depends which tach 2 or 3 wire if the tach will work
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72 GT Ute
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lynchster
Senior Member Joined: 07-January-2006 Location: Pennsylvania Status: Offline Points: 2150 |
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I'm told the pertronix is a good set up and easy to work with. I eventually settled on a modified Duraspark distributor but I'm not running a 400-500 horsepower car either.
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Chuck
72 Gran Torino Sport 13 Taurus SHO "Mr Pig" |
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lynchster
Senior Member Joined: 07-January-2006 Location: Pennsylvania Status: Offline Points: 2150 |
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I was thinking about gutting a Duraspark box and going that route. |
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Chuck
72 Gran Torino Sport 13 Taurus SHO "Mr Pig" |
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7T9_Tbird
Senior Member Joined: 04-December-2017 Location: Athens, Alabama Status: Offline Points: 495 |
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Is the '79 two or three wire? I just remember hooking the tach lead under the hood to the tach terminal on the cap and it worked, and was accurate!
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John
79 Thunderbird Heritage 79 Thunderbird Town Landau 02 Ram 1500 Sport Quad Cab |
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aquartlow
Senior Member Joined: 19-December-2011 Location: Summerfield, Fl Status: Offline Points: 2271 |
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Vince, if you go that route(been extremely happy with mine so far), get the 5-pin HEI module from an '80 Oldsmobile Toronado w/307, Standard Motor Products part#LX330. Works just like the 4-pin but with the 5-pin if you send a ground signal to that 5th pin it will retard the ignition timing 5 crankshaft degrees for as long as the ground signal is present. Makes for much easier starting even with 18-20 degrees of initial timing.
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www.supermotors.net/22468
Yeah, It's a Hybrid...It burns gas and tires. No matter how good she looks, somebody, somewhere, is tired of her sh*t. Beauty is skin deep, ugliness goes clear to the bone. |
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aquartlow
Senior Member Joined: 19-December-2011 Location: Summerfield, Fl Status: Offline Points: 2271 |
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The '77-'79 tachs are 3 wire.
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www.supermotors.net/22468
Yeah, It's a Hybrid...It burns gas and tires. No matter how good she looks, somebody, somewhere, is tired of her sh*t. Beauty is skin deep, ugliness goes clear to the bone. |
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aquartlow
Senior Member Joined: 19-December-2011 Location: Summerfield, Fl Status: Offline Points: 2271 |
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I totally agree with using the GM module(and I H8 GM), much easier to find and the aftermarket pieces are generally more reliable for the HEI modules than the Duraspark boxes, at least in the "Blue" strain relief versions of a DS box.
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www.supermotors.net/22468
Yeah, It's a Hybrid...It burns gas and tires. No matter how good she looks, somebody, somewhere, is tired of her sh*t. Beauty is skin deep, ugliness goes clear to the bone. |
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Rockatansky
Senior Member Joined: 30-July-2010 Location: On The Road Status: Offline Points: 6072 |
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that 5th pin could come in handy, Regular / Ethyl and emissions test lane mode it's the earlier 2 wire tach that doesn't like mess'n, it'll affect the OP's 72 that's why i brought it up |
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72 GT Ute
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72FordGTS
Admin Group GTS.org Admin Joined: 06-September-2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Status: Offline Points: 5846 |
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Thanks Todd. I remember we did a big ignition post a while ago where you went over all the details on your setup. My engine had a pertronix but I wanted to upgrade it to something with a cheaper and more reliable module while keeping it relatively stock (or at least Ford) looking. Here is the thread for the OP, which has lots of great info: |
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Vince
1972 Ford GTS Sportsroof - Survivor, One Family car GTS.org Admin |
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Billy C
Senior Member Joined: 10-February-2010 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Status: Offline Points: 948 |
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@ the OP,
I recommend taking whatever you had that worked before and just get the new setup running reliably enough to putt around. New plugs and wires of course. When you're ready to dial it in see what they have as far as interchangeable tuning parts for your current distributor. You can get really crazy with the tuning (dyno, tuner, the works) or get it to a comfortable spot (highway pulls, trying different stuff, seeing what makes the bigger smile). Either way, you will find out if what you had before doesn't have the guts to run the higher power setup.
Edited by Billy C - 28-February-2018 at 3:25PM |
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-Billy Conturo
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rrlcommish
Member Joined: 01-January-2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Status: Offline Points: 58 |
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Billy C.,
Thanks for the advice, I think that is how I will proceed. Hopefully the PS pump and alternator are still in working condition, they've been sitting for a few years while I have been finishing the other parts of this project (motor, body). Probably should replace all hoses and belts regardless. Hoping radiator is ok as well, at least as you say, to get 'er running again. It was working fine when parked.
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1972 Gran Torino Sport Fastback, Bored 30-over 351C - 4V, Lt Blue, Pertronix Ignitor, dual exhaust with Turbo mufflers, otherwise stock
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Eliteman76
Admin Group Joined: 20-March-2006 Location: Nebraska, USA Status: Offline Points: 5044 |
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My thoughts...good quality duraspark unit from Davis Unified Ignition, and the hotter duraspark box, forget the specifics but just google it. Duraspark can support around 600hp.
I'm running a 1978 400 duraspark in my 1971 351c 2v in my gts. Spliced in wiring harness off one of my 351W 1976 Elite duraspark harnesses mated into the 1972 harness. Engine harness is partial rebuilt using an NOS 1974 LTD 400 harness I got off eBay. Otherwise I'd lean towards old school Mallory...but they got bought out by MSD if I recall 1-2 years ago. I drive my GTS so I stick to knowing I can get duraspark parts within about any town I hit up. Be it near home or on Hot Rod Powertour or where ever. |
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Andrew:GTS.ORG admin, '72 Q code 5 speed Restomod
Pondering: #99Problems |
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