INFO: 72 - 79 Gauge Clusters and Wiring |
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Power Surge
Senior Member Joined: 06-March-2016 Location: Palm Coast, FL Status: Offline Points: 542 |
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When you say another wire....do you mean off the tach? Does your tach have two wires or three coming off it? Your circuit should be like this.... Ign swtich>--resistor wire--red/green wire into tach>--TACH--<red/green wire out of tach---- positive coil post. |
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Sal Mennella
73 GTS 351 CJ 75 Cougar XR7 73 Ranchero - 5.0 Coyote swap - in progress Past Torinos - 72 Gran Torino, 75 Gran Torino, 75 Elite |
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72torino...
Member Joined: 12-June-2017 Location: Ohio Status: Offline Points: 130 |
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I have a two wire tach. One side says IGN the other side says coil. If the wiring is the way you have it described I don’t have it correct. I’ll work on that tomorrow and report back. Very thankful for your help. Wiring can be quite frustrating
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Power Surge
Senior Member Joined: 06-March-2016 Location: Palm Coast, FL Status: Offline Points: 542 |
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Alright, here is what I wound up doing...
I used the underhood key on power wire (I think it was originally the optional idle solenoid power), hooked to the + coil post. I put the red wire from the dist to the + coil post. I then used the "I" terminal on the starter solenoid for crank power, and hooked it to the + coil post. The original ignition/tach wire from the car is now disconnected from the coil. The car starts perfect and runs great. Just no tach operation now. I will have to send the tach out to be converted at some point.
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Sal Mennella
73 GTS 351 CJ 75 Cougar XR7 73 Ranchero - 5.0 Coyote swap - in progress Past Torinos - 72 Gran Torino, 75 Gran Torino, 75 Elite |
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californiajohnny
Moderator Group Joined: 05-October-2013 Location: winlock, wa Status: Offline Points: 14609 |
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Edited by californiajohnny - 15-October-2017 at 7:05PM |
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JOHN
74 GRAN TORINO S&H CLONE 74 VETTE CUSTOM 90 S10 BLAZER 4X4 LIFTED 77 CELICA CUSTOM 75 V8 MONZA SUPERCHARGED 79 COURIER VERT. SLAMMED 75 VEGA V6 5 SPD 70 CHEV C10 P/U 68 MUSTANG FB CONVERSION |
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californiajohnny
Moderator Group Joined: 05-October-2013 Location: winlock, wa Status: Offline Points: 14609 |
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if it's wired like this and the tach dies usually the engine won't run! i say usually!!! i converted my dash and the car ran but the tach didn't work! i replaced the tach with another one and it works
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JOHN
74 GRAN TORINO S&H CLONE 74 VETTE CUSTOM 90 S10 BLAZER 4X4 LIFTED 77 CELICA CUSTOM 75 V8 MONZA SUPERCHARGED 79 COURIER VERT. SLAMMED 75 VEGA V6 5 SPD 70 CHEV C10 P/U 68 MUSTANG FB CONVERSION |
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BackInBlack
Senior Member Joined: 11-January-2011 Location: Virginia Status: Offline Points: 1013 |
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An alternative approach to that tach wiring is simple bypass the wire at the Tach connector in the harness under the dash. This cuts the tach out of the circuit. In place of the 2 wires passing through the connector 1 of the wires can be "repurposed" as a voltage tach sensor wire. This requires replacing the tach with a new style voltage tach. I have the tach output of my MSD box integrated into the engine wiring harness now. All the extra ignition control signals, including the tach from the MSD box (6AL-2 programmable), is a separate harness that follows the old harness in the engine bay and passes through the firewall through the hole where the old EGR control harness passed through. I removed all the EGR harness. (72 doesn't have this EGR circuit and will require mods to the firewall.)
This how I'm handling the tach in the near future. I have a decal kit to redo the face of the tach to convert to 8K and plan to send my tach to rocketman in the near future for the conversion. He tests and calibrates the tach. I called and spoke to him about his conversion and the test equipment he uses. Pic of this conversion Diagram of teh circuit described Hope this helps.
Edited by BackInBlack - 16-October-2017 at 12:50PM |
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-John
1973 GTS |
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72FordGTS
Admin Group GTS.org Admin Joined: 06-September-2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Status: Offline Points: 5846 |
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I am not too familiar with the RTR MSD distributors, but it sounds like you may correct about the direct connection. I did a lot of research and bottom line is that it's really tough and a ton of hassle to keep the factory tach. It's just so much easier to convert it to a three wire voltage reading tach, since it's connected in parallel and has no effect on the ignition whatsoever. And even if you can get a in series Amp sensing tach to work properly, how long before that 45 year old instrument craps out? At least with the conversion you get a modern accurate tach movement. I know John mentioned the Tach adaptors too, but I read mixed reviews on them working properly. It costs a few bucks, but I stand by that the Tach conversion is the best and easiest way to have a non-stock ignition and have a factory appearing tach that is reliable and accurate. It sounds like the bypass of the tach is the best thing until you can get it converted.
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Vince
1972 Ford GTS Sportsroof - Survivor, One Family car GTS.org Admin |
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72torino...
Member Joined: 12-June-2017 Location: Ohio Status: Offline Points: 130 |
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Just wanted to thank you all for the assistance I was able to get my tach working the other night.
This website has been a great resource |
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forddude
Member Joined: 22-May-2012 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 175 |
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BIG THANKS to everyone that helped assemble this detailed info and the members that have contributed to helping troubleshoot. I’m considering upgrading to the sport cluster. I understand I’ll have to add some wiring for the tach, amp, and change the oil sensor.
I assume the best way to test the printed circuit is to hook up the pigtail to a car battery? How do I remove the clock adjustment knob? The adjustment pin spins as it should and I am able to adjust the clock, but want to disassemble the cluster to restore but cannot figure how the clock knob is removed and don’t want to end up breaking it. |
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72 GTS sportsroof, original survivor
72 GTS formal, parted 96 Tbird 4.6, 18k org mi 13 Stang 5.0 6spd |
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bdaugette
Senior Member Joined: 02-December-2013 Location: United States Status: Offline Points: 259 |
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I am thinking there is a tiny screw on the clock shaft. Take a look, it’s tiny.
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Bill Daugette
72 GTS 351C 4V |
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forddude
Member Joined: 22-May-2012 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 175 |
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Yup there is and is just snapped the shaft trying to break loose that tiny screw. |
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72 GTS sportsroof, original survivor
72 GTS formal, parted 96 Tbird 4.6, 18k org mi 13 Stang 5.0 6spd |
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MACH429
Brand New Member Joined: 27-December-2017 Location: NC Status: Offline Points: 2 |
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I have a tach and gauges dash from a 72 Torino that I would like to install in my 76 Torino that currently has the standard dash. Looking at the posts on this thread I think my cat has a six pin connector in it now. Has anyone done this conversion? Any info would be appreciated. Thanks.
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1976 Starsky Torino
2013 Shelby GT 500 1970 Torino GT 1966 Fairlane GT |
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californiajohnny
Moderator Group Joined: 05-October-2013 Location: winlock, wa Status: Offline Points: 14609 |
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it can be done
i think the 72 connector has 2 less wires? i swapped a sport dash into my 74 but it was 74 to 74 and i had to swap positions on 2 or 3 wires in the connector |
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JOHN
74 GRAN TORINO S&H CLONE 74 VETTE CUSTOM 90 S10 BLAZER 4X4 LIFTED 77 CELICA CUSTOM 75 V8 MONZA SUPERCHARGED 79 COURIER VERT. SLAMMED 75 VEGA V6 5 SPD 70 CHEV C10 P/U 68 MUSTANG FB CONVERSION |
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forddude
Member Joined: 22-May-2012 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 175 |
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Read the first page of this tread, it will help you understand the difference of the two clusters you have. 72 uses a 12 pin connector, 76 uses a 14 pin connector. So the 72 cluster will not plug into your 76 harness. I’d imagine you would have to cut off your 76 wire harness plug and splice every wire to the 72 connector plug (assuming you have the 72 plug that connects to the circuit board). If you don’t have the harness plug for the 72 cluster, you might want to find one. I’m NO expert on this, but might be a lot easier if you simply source a 76 sport cluster. Edited by forddude - 30-December-2017 at 11:09AM |
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72 GTS sportsroof, original survivor
72 GTS formal, parted 96 Tbird 4.6, 18k org mi 13 Stang 5.0 6spd |
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Rockatansky
Senior Member Joined: 30-July-2010 Location: On The Road Status: Offline Points: 6072 |
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does the car need the ammeter shunt wire added in or does it already exist in the 1976 factory harness? and the 72 uses the 3 wire tach that is wired in series to the coil + ... besides possibly tracing, repining and splicing in a 12 pin plug to suit the 72 cluster, those are the 2 biggest hurdles i can think of a work-around that may help make it happen is convert the ammeter to volts, use a 2 wire tach and white gauge face overlays so the fonts all match. you may need both the 72 and whatever year the tach is (for the odometer openings to be in the right place) overlay kits but that's the least of it |
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72 GT Ute
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forddude
Member Joined: 22-May-2012 Location: USA Status: Offline Points: 175 |
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MACH429, there is a member selling a 75/76 sport cluster right now on the forum! It might be an easier option for you, check it out...
http://forum.grantorinosport.org/gauge-cluster_topic16747.html ...and PM me if you end up wanting to sell your 72 cluster ok, thanks. Edited by forddude - 30-December-2017 at 2:37PM |
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72 GTS sportsroof, original survivor
72 GTS formal, parted 96 Tbird 4.6, 18k org mi 13 Stang 5.0 6spd |
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MACH429
Brand New Member Joined: 27-December-2017 Location: NC Status: Offline Points: 2 |
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Thanks to everyone for the information. I'm going to pull out the standard cluster and see if I can trace out the wiring. Converting to volts will probably be my best option. Your help is much appreciated.
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1976 Starsky Torino
2013 Shelby GT 500 1970 Torino GT 1966 Fairlane GT |
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Rockatansky
Senior Member Joined: 30-July-2010 Location: On The Road Status: Offline Points: 6072 |
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but is there an ammeter in the stock cluster,or just the ALT warning lamp?
Edited by Rockatansky - 30-December-2017 at 7:30PM |
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72 GT Ute
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72FordGTS
Admin Group GTS.org Admin Joined: 06-September-2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Status: Offline Points: 5846 |
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The stock cluster has no ammeter so there is likely no shunt. The easiest way would be to use a voltmeter. Rocketman can convert an ammeter gauge to a voltmeter.
Also the early cars used two wire Tachs and then later cars used three wire. Three wire Tachs are easier to deal with and Rocketman can convert them too. |
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Vince
1972 Ford GTS Sportsroof - Survivor, One Family car GTS.org Admin |
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Rockatansky
Senior Member Joined: 30-July-2010 Location: On The Road Status: Offline Points: 6072 |
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oops i thought it was the other way around on the tach wire count
2 wires is early, straight through in series 3 wires is late, power / ground / signal
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72 GT Ute
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NeillNZ
Member Joined: 27-June-2016 Location: Wellington, NZ Status: Offline Points: 40 |
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Hi people,
Neill here. I am in New Zealand. My project car is not a Torino but an Australian Ford Falcon that I am using as the basis for a Madmax tribute car. When my attention was drawn to the dash cluster in my car I decided to investigate producing a repro printed circuit as they are not available. Just like the Torino circuits from the same era the Aussie Falcon circuits are prone to delaminating, cracking, peeling etc. It was a steep learning curve. I also had to find a manufacturer who good make them. Since reproducing the circuit for my XC I have made them for 7 other Aussie cars mostly Fords. I have been looking for more to do and have hooked up with a chap in Florida who was sent me his dash cluster from his standard(without tach) dash. I'm most of the way through the process as can be seen here: To give you an idea of the finished result Here is one of the ones I've done before, it is for a ZF & ZG Aussie Fairlane which was produced from around '72 to '75. Hopefully I will play a part in keeping some people's cars on the road. Edited by NeillNZ - 24-January-2018 at 3:19PM |
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BackInBlack
Senior Member Joined: 11-January-2011 Location: Virginia Status: Offline Points: 1013 |
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That is really helpful. I'm using multiple clusters to get good parts from... the most problematic part is that flex circuit. They all start to de-laminate after 40+ years of heat and use.
The other item I find extremely difficult to find are clear gauges lens. They all tend to yellow with age.
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-John
1973 GTS |
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Power Surge
Senior Member Joined: 06-March-2016 Location: Palm Coast, FL Status: Offline Points: 542 |
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This was my solution.... |
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Sal Mennella
73 GTS 351 CJ 75 Cougar XR7 73 Ranchero - 5.0 Coyote swap - in progress Past Torinos - 72 Gran Torino, 75 Gran Torino, 75 Elite |
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californiajohnny
Moderator Group Joined: 05-October-2013 Location: winlock, wa Status: Offline Points: 14609 |
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Neil, welcome! this is great! there are a few different versions through the years as well as standard and sport with tach
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JOHN
74 GRAN TORINO S&H CLONE 74 VETTE CUSTOM 90 S10 BLAZER 4X4 LIFTED 77 CELICA CUSTOM 75 V8 MONZA SUPERCHARGED 79 COURIER VERT. SLAMMED 75 VEGA V6 5 SPD 70 CHEV C10 P/U 68 MUSTANG FB CONVERSION |
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72FordGTS
Admin Group GTS.org Admin Joined: 06-September-2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Status: Offline Points: 5846 |
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This is great work Neil! If you ever end up doing a sport cluster, I'd be on board for one. How much do these printed circuit cost?
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Vince
1972 Ford GTS Sportsroof - Survivor, One Family car GTS.org Admin |
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NeillNZ
Member Joined: 27-June-2016 Location: Wellington, NZ Status: Offline Points: 40 |
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I thought the sport cluster one was already available? I must admit I could not find one with a Goggle search. Not sure on cost yet. I'm doing all the design/layout work for free because I just want to help and I enjoy it. I will be using a manufacturer here in NZ because they make a good product and are excellent to deal with. The first run will be just 10. Those 10 will be posted to a chap in Florida along with his cluster that I have here. Once we have all the costs worked out we will come up with a price but I'm guessing it will be around the $100 mark, maybe more because of the small volume. |
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NeillNZ
Member Joined: 27-June-2016 Location: Wellington, NZ Status: Offline Points: 40 |
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Nice work. No problems with cracking or peeling! |
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californiajohnny
Moderator Group Joined: 05-October-2013 Location: winlock, wa Status: Offline Points: 14609 |
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you may be thinking of the white plastic housing for the sport clusters ...they are just now being reproduced by a company recently but not the PC board that i'm aware of?
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JOHN
74 GRAN TORINO S&H CLONE 74 VETTE CUSTOM 90 S10 BLAZER 4X4 LIFTED 77 CELICA CUSTOM 75 V8 MONZA SUPERCHARGED 79 COURIER VERT. SLAMMED 75 VEGA V6 5 SPD 70 CHEV C10 P/U 68 MUSTANG FB CONVERSION |
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NeillNZ
Member Joined: 27-June-2016 Location: Wellington, NZ Status: Offline Points: 40 |
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I have finished the layout for now. Still deciding about how to attach the snaps for the connection to the instrument Voltage regulator, hence the tiny holes.
The next step is to have a 'mech' made. It is made without the copper and without the mask layers. It is used to test fit to the plastic housing. That way if there are any errors and hence adjustments to be made I will have saved the cost of setting up to print the copper and mask layers. Here is the scan: This scan was used to trace the mask, missing the centre as my scanner is only A4/Letter size. |
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californiajohnny
Moderator Group Joined: 05-October-2013 Location: winlock, wa Status: Offline Points: 14609 |
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i think the snaps are the same as the ones on a 9 volt battery?
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JOHN
74 GRAN TORINO S&H CLONE 74 VETTE CUSTOM 90 S10 BLAZER 4X4 LIFTED 77 CELICA CUSTOM 75 V8 MONZA SUPERCHARGED 79 COURIER VERT. SLAMMED 75 VEGA V6 5 SPD 70 CHEV C10 P/U 68 MUSTANG FB CONVERSION |
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