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Got a question for Celeveland heads

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351BBGTS View Drop Down
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    Posted: 07-May-2008 at 7:37AM
Ok so the motor in my 73 GTS spun a bearing last week. I've been trying to figure out what to do, due to the fact iam very limited on money.  I found a guy who has a few 351's in his storage unit and i think ones a Modified and the other two are Windsors.  I have a Celeveland in my car so Iwas wo ndering if the Cleveland heads would fit on a Windsor or Modified block?? Im pretty sure they WONT fit on the windsor since its a small block.  But  I figured the Clev. heads would fit on the Modified block.
 
anybody know?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PatsPOS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-May-2008 at 5:02PM
OK, the Cleveland heads WILL fit on a Windsor, but these days it's more of a PITA than it's worth.  I was still in my teens when I read the article, but it boils down to the fact that some water passages need to be plugged, and others need to be opened up.  Then there's the issue of an intake manifold...there WAS a company years ago that made an intake specifically for Windsors with Cleveland heads.  I'm pretty sure that now your only chance in hell of finding one would be if you scoured eBay for months, and then you'd probably be expected to PAY!
 
OTOH, the 351M already has Cleveland heads...the reason it's called a "modified" is due only to the fact that it's basically a Cleveland block, but with the same motor mounts and bellhousing pattern as a 400.
 
If your open to the idea, why not build the Windsor a bit?  Dollar for dollar, you'll come out ahead, IMO.  Plus, you'd get to keep the Cleveland motor mounts and bell pattern.  Don't get me wrong....I'm far from being a Cleveland hater.  But you could build a rip-roarin' Windsor that would put a Cleveland to shame for the same amount of money.
 
Good luck...
Pat
'75 460 Gran Torino Sport (14.04 @ 97 MPH)
'91 Crown Vic (18.09 @ 75 MPH)
'89 300 F-150 (18.37 @ 73 MPH)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 351BBGTS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-May-2008 at 7:46AM
Eesh i dont really want to deal with clogging water holes and opening some up.  Basically i just wanted something i can bolt together, drop in my car, and go get some A$$
 
well my car came with the original Cleveland motor, so if i wanted to do a Windsor project i would have to buy new motor mounts?
 
ill probably end up doing a Windsor build.  The reason why iwanted the Cleveland heads at least is because of the valve ports are bigger.  but i will admit i have seen some blazin Windsors around here. I'm only 18 and money IS an option, so it would be awhile before i get this thing up on its feet.  I figured if i wanted a high horsepower motor i'd have to get the tranny rebuilt ( or find a rebuilt one ) along with a rebuilt rear end. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PatsPOS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-May-2008 at 6:34AM
Like I said, you can keep the Cleveland motor mounts for the Windsor.  And your existing transmission will bolt up to a Windsor, too.  I doubt you'll need to do anything in regards to upgrading your rear end...the 9" can take quite a bit of horsepower before you have to do anything to it.  Although everyone could use a steeper gear, right?  The tranny, well...that depends a lot on how well it's been maintained up to this point.  If you build a mild Windsor (4V intake, mild cam, headers, and not much else), I doubt your current transmission would have any problems dealing with the engine.
 
Of course, I've been known to be wrong before! Tongue
 
Pat
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 351BBGTS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-May-2008 at 9:33AM
well ijust wanted to upgrade in diff. gears because i have crumby highway gearing in mine.  so it seems like not much power gets to the ground.  and the tranny, its been well maintained actually. the lady we bought it from ( original owner ) never tore it up. it was granny driven basically.  though when i was young and dumb i did have a few moments where i'd rev it in neutral and drop it to drive. that was only twice though.  never again did i do it. so the tranny should be good. i just have to pull it and clean all the old grease off of it. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 351BBGTS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-May-2008 at 7:10AM
Alright so now that i am done with classes for high school i have some spare time on my hands.  I dont have much time at all though due to the fact i have graduation on the 29th then leaving for vacation and then i start my new job the day i get back.  So really i have about a week to get a lot done.  Im waiting on this guy to call me back about a windsor motor.  I really need to get this done because i dont have a car to get me to my job.  I just had a few questions about some things:

First, is the tranny drain plug next to the shifter linkage? i was looking around and that looked like the only bolt that would be sufficient to draining the tranny fluid.  And when i drain it where do i take it to get rid of it?
Second, when im pulling the motor out what do you guys usually do with your A/C components? i figured just unhook what i could and put it to the side since i heard it was illegal to emit the freon gases in the air or something. 

if you guys could help me out that would be great! thanks
 -Ryan
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote JimW Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-May-2008 at 7:03AM
No plug for draining the trans, usually just loosen bolts more on one end (you can even remove the bolts completely from the back end of the pan) and let the end of the pan drop a little .  Once the fluid sops running, you can loosen more and tilt more and do that until you have all bolts out.. (you can also just plug the cooler holes, the speedo cable hole, dipstick hole and use a spare yoke for the output shaft and then pull the trans w/o leaking fluid..)
 
As for disposal, just call Advance Auto, they may recycle it like motor oil.
 
Finally, I have heard of disconnecting the compressor from it's mounts and carefully hanging it out of the way to remove the motor in order to conserve the freon.
 
Jim
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 351BBGTS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-May-2008 at 12:22PM
yeah i finally just unbolted a few and let it drip out.  I heard of the plugging the holes but i didnt have a spare yoke to use.  anyhow i just brought it up to auto zone and they got rid of it for me. 

as for the A/C, i barely had any freon left in the compressor. the hose from that black box in the firewall up to the compressor, i just slowly unscrewed it to see what happened and i could hear it leaking and after like 3 or 4 seconds it was done. so i just tooke the hose off but left the compressor bolted to the motor. 

other than that all i have to do is take my exhaust manifolds off ( those pipe to manifold bolts at the flange were impossible to get off ) and the motor should be ready to come out. i'll probably go ahead and take off the A/C compressor, maybe go ahead and take off the carb, distributor and take off the intake manifold as well the heads to make it a little lighter.  I leave tomorrow for Myrtle Beach for a week and then my new job starts so i have to bum a ride with my mom ( nothing more than graduating high school yet your mom takes you places ). I"ll give you guys pictures soon
'73 Gran Torino Sport "H" Code
Out with the Cleveland, In with the Windsor
Cleveland build in the near future
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