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OD trannies?

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    Posted: 16-January-2011 at 6:05AM
So I was thinking... What OD trannies are available for the OTHER engines in our cars.
 
302/351W/429/460 have AOD type OD trannies available from later model Ford cars and trucks.
 
What about the 351C/351M/400 motors?
 
Talking about the possibility of selling the Dakota this summer to buy a Ranchero I can make a hauling rig out of. Finding many of the Rancheros with the C/M motors and was wondering if there is an OD tranny option I can use to get a good highway speed MPG?
 
A the 351 motors will have ample power for what I am looking at doing and still be able to get decent mileage around town when not needing the power to tow.
A 460 is the obvious option for all around truck power, but I've been doing it all these years with my 318/5.2L Dakota. So not thinking the lack of MPG of the 460 is really needed.
 
a 351W with a good cam, intake, carb will give all the power needed to haul a loaded 2 car trailer.
But if the Car comes with a C or M can I put an OD behind it for the same result?


Edited by cowboyupdjcarl - 16-January-2011 at 6:11AM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ron Earp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-January-2011 at 9:33AM
Don't the 335 M block (351M, 400) and the 385 (429/460) have the same bellhousing bolt pattern? Which would mean anything you can put behind a 460 you can put behind the 351M/400 and that should open up quite a bit for you beyond the C6. There are lots of five and six speed manual trannies available.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Blueoval76 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-January-2011 at 10:09AM
That would mean then an E4OD which stock IMHO is junk from past expierences but can be built and is what was used in the trucks.
 
 
There is also a 4R70W but that that is for a SBF.
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote occupant Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-January-2011 at 3:07PM
E4OD's aren't worth the trouble. You can build a pretty stout AOD these days with some 4R70W guts and better aftermarket hard parts as well. The bellhousing can be cut off at a welding shop and then you can bolt on what's called a JW Ultra Bell, giving you a large pattern bellhousing on the AOD. Done deal. Of course you have to get the Lokar throttle cable and an FMX mount you can flip over. And the driveshaft won't work, but I have heard that the driveshaft from an AOD equipped 90-92 or so Town Car will fit PERFECTLY if you use an adapter u-joint to fit your 9" out back.

But for $325 for the bell, $60 for the cable, and $50 for the welding shop work, it's a lot better than trying to shoehorn a weak E4OD in there or spending $2K on a Gear Vendors overdrive unit.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 73 GT Sport 429 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-January-2011 at 4:54PM
I have an E4OD in my truck and it has worked flawlessly. The last time I changed the fluid (about a year ago at 130K) the pan didn't have any clucth dust or metal. In fact the inside of the galvalized pan was shiny. It was cleaner than any of the Benz trans pans I have had off at work. I have about 80 1/4 time slips from drag racing it in the 90's. Guess I'm lucky. They are electronically controlled but, I would like one in my old Torino.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GranTorinoSport Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-January-2011 at 5:06PM
x2 on the GearVendors unit.

I have actually run some calculations on the rpm drop when using it with:

1.  My Torino with a 2.75 axle
2.  My F-250 with a 4.10 axle

For the F-250, the $2700 unit (yes, two thousand seven hundred dollars) would pay for itself as a daily driver used in freeway applications. The 7-8 MPG I get with it could (potentially) go up to 10-11 MPG. That's huge. For 15,000 miles per year, do the math. It would pay for itself.

For the Torino... not so much. Using Paul's idea (Psquare75) for the E4OD wide-ratio transmission, I don't see the financial payoff unless you plan on traveling above 75 MPH consistently.

For a Ranchero with lower gears (3.50 or up)... I'd do it without a thought. No TV cable adjustment to burn out the transmission. No expensive transmission. No fitment issues (relatively). It's a cleaner install from what I can see.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GranTorinoSport Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-January-2011 at 5:15PM
Oh, yes, and 351M / 400 uses big block transmission mount. 351C uses small block (351W style) transmission mount.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Psquare75 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-January-2011 at 4:44AM
I still haven't decided what I want to do. Sadly if this were a GM the answer would be get a 700r4 from the local junkyard. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lynchster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-January-2011 at 12:10PM
Originally posted by occupant occupant wrote:

E4OD's aren't worth the trouble. You can build a pretty stout AOD these days with some 4R70W guts and better aftermarket hard parts as well. The bellhousing can be cut off at a welding shop and then you can bolt on what's called a JW Ultra Bell, giving you a large pattern bellhousing on the AOD. Done deal. Of course you have to get the Lokar throttle cable and an FMX mount you can flip over. And the driveshaft won't work, but I have heard that the driveshaft from an AOD equipped 90-92 or so Town Car will fit PERFECTLY if you use an adapter u-joint to fit your 9" out back.

But for $325 for the bell, $60 for the cable, and $50 for the welding shop work, it's a lot better than trying to shoehorn a weak E4OD in there or spending $2K on a Gear Vendors overdrive unit.
 
Did the run the AOD behind the 460 pickups? If so there is the bolt pattern for the 351M/400.
I swapped and AOD into the Ranchero and I have no idea what they were talking about as far as "flipping the crossmember. I seem to remember putting mine back in the way it came out. My engine and trans came out of an 85 so I have the older and weaker AOD but the engine is basically stock anyway.
The 85 also didn't have the towing package so I used a permanant sealed combination U joint to attach the slip yoke to my original driveshaft. It was a pretty straight forward installation. The only real creativity was fabricating the bracket so I could use my cable actuated column shifter. Haven't had a problem with it yet except that the 3.00 to 1 gears are a bit tall for the .67 overdrive.   
 
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GranTorinoSport Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-January-2011 at 1:05PM
Originally posted by lynchster lynchster wrote:

Originally posted by occupant occupant wrote:

E4OD's aren't worth the trouble. You can build a pretty stout AOD these days with some 4R70W guts and better aftermarket hard parts as well. The bellhousing can be cut off at a welding shop and then you can bolt on what's called a JW Ultra Bell, giving you a large pattern bellhousing on the AOD. Done deal. Of course you have to get the Lokar throttle cable and an FMX mount you can flip over. And the driveshaft won't work, but I have heard that the driveshaft from an AOD equipped 90-92 or so Town Car will fit PERFECTLY if you use an adapter u-joint to fit your 9" out back.

But for $325 for the bell, $60 for the cable, and $50 for the welding shop work, it's a lot better than trying to shoehorn a weak E4OD in there or spending $2K on a Gear Vendors overdrive unit.
 
Did the run the AOD behind the 460 pickups? If so there is the bolt pattern for the 351M/400.
I swapped and AOD into the Ranchero and I have no idea what they were talking about as far as "flipping the crossmember. I seem to remember putting mine back in the way it came out. My engine and trans came out of an 85 so I have the older and weaker AOD but the engine is basically stock anyway.
The 85 also didn't have the towing package so I used a permanant sealed combination U joint to attach the slip yoke to my original driveshaft. It was a pretty straight forward installation. The only real creativity was fabricating the bracket so I could use my cable actuated column shifter. Haven't had a problem with it yet except that the 3.00 to 1 gears are a bit tall for the .67 overdrive.   
 
 


Below 2000 rpm at highway speeds I imagine?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Regul8r Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-January-2011 at 3:56PM
yes I am wondering the same thing?
RPM at what speed with what tire.
I have an early model AOD going in mine.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote lynchster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-January-2011 at 4:00PM
Originally posted by GranTorinoSport GranTorinoSport wrote:

Below 2000 rpm at highway speeds I imagine?
Just a bitLOL. I'm guesstimating 1700-1800 at 65. We assumed (bad word) the wagon had a 3.08 rear and the speedometer would be close. Not so much. I'm figuring it might have been 3.23 or even a 3.55.
 
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On the bright side I'm sitting on a rebuilt 4.11 posi I had in the Torino for a spell. I have to have it checked out because I did manage to snap an axle off in it. Doesn't look bad but it looks as if it may have damaged the bearing cage.  


Edited by lynchster - 17-January-2011 at 4:03PM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fordpower Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-January-2011 at 11:54AM
How many aod are there. My pinto has one mechanical the pan reads merc aod I was thinking of putting it in my ltd2. Was told I could run350 gears instead of my 243 and have same mpg?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Regul8r Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-January-2011 at 2:45PM
Mustang GTs in the 80's ran the AOD with 3.08 rear gears, I ran a carb'd '88 5.0 motor, AOD, 3.08 rears and 275/60/15 and it got GREAT mileage. Cannot remember the RPM at 55-65mph but it was LOW!
 
The 89-93 Thunderbird SuperCoupes run AOD with 3.27 gears, stock tires on it are 225/60/16 whish are the same size (Rotations) as the 295/50/15.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fordpower Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-January-2011 at 2:26AM
mine is sapost to be out of a early 80's full size wagon.Ford man in town said anything after 76 is elect not mach,who knows I don't.
thank for the reply
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote stanman Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-January-2011 at 11:35AM
My '87 Crown Vic and my '89 F150 had AOD's (mechanical) and both my '94 F150's had 4R70W's (electric). I think they changed to electric types in 1990, not exactly sure.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fordpower Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-January-2011 at 1:10PM
That makes sence since mine is sapose to be out of a 85 full size merc.
My invoice on the 79 states fordamatic 3speed it was an optional trans.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote fordpower Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-January-2011 at 4:10AM
correction its a slectshift 3speed not an option.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Torinogts73c Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-January-2011 at 6:47AM
I installed an AOD in 74 Ranchero about 15 yrs ago behind a 351C motor and it worked great. I used a TV rod off of a Crown Vic w/a 351W. As far as E4OD trans are concerned My 96 Bronco has one behind a 5.8 EFI with 130k on it still works fine. As well as the one in my 95 Lightning.
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