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mfgriffin View Drop Down
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    Posted: 18-February-2021 at 4:27PM
Just found these forums and have started pouring over the previous posts.  Seems like a great place and tons of helpful people as well.  I've had a 72 GTS with a 351c I've been moving from house to house for years that I've always wanted to restore. It sat parked for years and with my limited resources and knowledge the work was just a bit more than I could handle.  I managed to fine a beautiful numbers matching 72 GTS on ebay and decides to pick that up so I've now got 2 sitting in the garage.  Looking forward to the summer so I can start enjoying the new one and will probably be looking for a home for the old one soon.  Hopefully I'll be able to share some pics soon.  The new one just arrived a few hours ago so I haven't been able to go over it yet, but we so excited that I had to come on here and say "Hi!".

Awesome resource and I'm looking forward to learning more.
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As soon as Vince upgrades you, pics will be allowed. Welcome aboard. Looking forward to lots of pics and backstory of the hunt to find your ride.
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Welcome aboard! We'd love to see the one you've had for years and the new one too, and stories for both.
Enjoy the ride!
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Welcome to the forum!  I have upgraded you so you now can post pictures.  That's cool that you have 2 Torinos.  Post some pics of the cars when you have a chance.
Vince

1972 Ford GTS Sportsroof - Survivor, One Family car

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Welcome! 
Dan

1970 Ford Torino hardtop - 351C 4V - FMX - 9" 3.89 TrueTrac
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Thanks for the warm welcomes!  My Dad was always a stereotypical greaser(hair slicked back, cuffs on his blue jeans, white pocket tee with his red softpack rolled up in the sleeve) and loved working on cars and even racing them when he was younger.  Back in his wilder days his Gran Torino was his baby.  It was even the car I came home from the hospital in.  He started to experience both health and financial problems when I was pretty young and the car got parked, he would go tinker with it on occasion, but it just eventually got parked on the side of his house and it sat for years.  He eventually gave it to me and while I never restored it(I don't really know much about cars past basic stuff.  I change my own oil, can replace simple things like a starter, etc.)  I did manage to get it running one last time before he passed and I called him on the phone so he could hear it and I could hear him getting emotional.  I took it to several places and having it restored was going to be more than I could justify.  

I was pretty disheartened after speaking to a few shops so my wife started scouring the internet and managed to find one for sale down in Alabama.  After much deliberation on my part and lots of encouragement/pushing from the wife I finally decided to pull the trigger.  Contacted the seller, had the car inspected, and then shipped to Indiana.  The weather is terrible here right now so I struggled to get the thing up my driveway and into the garage last night so I won't be driving it for a while, but I've probably opened my garage door 20 times to just stare at it.  This has been my dream car since I was 4 years old and my dad would drive me around the neighborhood and let me steer.  

So that's the story of how I came to own 2 1972 Ford Gran Torinos!   I'll shut up now and post some pictures!
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Thanks for sharing your story as well as pictures. I bet your Dad is smiling down at you. Judging by the tandem bike and how much encouragement she offers, you have a keeper there. 
  Can you post the first five symbols of the VINS when you get a minute? This will give us more info as to where the cars were made and what engines they were born with. The door tag has even more info. You can blackout the serial number if you like.
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Thanks for the kind words!  Yeah, can't say I know too many guys whose wives insist they buy an old car, I got lucky.  She does hate the tandem though...  You win some you lose some :)

Here are the pics of the tags.  This may be a dumb question(told you I knew nothing about cars), but you mentioned blacking out the serial so I did.  What's the harm in posting the full VIN?  Is it just because it will be registered in my name or something more nefarious?

Thanks!
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Welcome. We love the pictures, and those both look like fine 72 GT Sports.
Don
73 Ranchero "Sport 72 front end", floor shift/console, planning EFI 7000+ rpm 351-4V &4R70W
73 Ranchero GT 351C-4V &4R70W for sale later.
92 Lincoln Mark VII SE GTC, OBDII 347/4R70W
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welcome! your original car really don't look too bad, but the new one... wow...beautifulShockedClap
JOHN
74 GRAN TORINO S&H CLONE
74 VETTE CUSTOM
90 S10 BLAZER 4X4 LIFTED
77 CELICA CUSTOM
75 V8 MONZA SUPERCHARGED
79 COURIER VERT. SLAMMED
75 VEGA V6 5 SPD
70 CHEV C10 P/U
68 MUSTANG FB CONVERSION
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Some people don't like to post the whole VIN. You have two q codes. Wow. Both Atlanta built. 
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Do both still have the 351CJ?
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Sooooo, here's where I'm going to show my ignorance.  My Grandpa owned his own transmission shop, my Dad was a hobbyist, I became a software engineer so the car bug kinda skipped a generation.  I'm not crazy knowledgeable on how to tell them apart.  What part of the VIN is telling you that they have CJs?  I was told that both had Clevelands and further told that the new one was numbers matching, but I haven't checked/verified that as of yet.  

Planning to thoroughly go over it tomorrow just to figure out what the differences are and what little things need fixed (already know the lock is broken on the new one as well as the latch for the glove box being a little finicky)

To further address your question and to be completely honest I'm not really sure how to check, but your question has now got me searching on how to check!   I really do want to learn so I appreciate the patience.  
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The Q in the VIN tells us it had a 351CJ which is a Cleveland. They were often a 4-bolt main engine block and had 4-barrel carburetors. The air cleaner lid was chrome. It really doesn't matter much. It is just pretty cool figuring out what is what.
   Stick around, you will gain knowledge by the minute. I spent months pouring iver every thread on the site and enjoyed every minute. 


Edited by handsofstone - 19-February-2021 at 7:46AM
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Thanks, your questions led me to this site so I figured it out.  https://www.tpocr.com/fordvin12.html

I gather that a CJ is just a beefier Cleveland then?
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Maybe. It might be 4-bolt main bearing caps or not. They were stout whichever ones you have. They Q Codes are the most desireable next to a 4-speed transmission. 

Edited by handsofstone - 19-February-2021 at 8:09AM
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If you get a Marti Report for the cars it tells everything about it from day it was ordered until delivery.
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Originally posted by mfgriffin mfgriffin wrote:

Thanks, your questions led me to this site so I figured it out.  https://www.tpocr.com/fordvin12.html

I gather that a CJ is just a beefier Cleveland then?
On the main page here, there is a registry for our cars. Also, there is a decoding thread with some of the options based on the door tag info. 
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   The blocks were cast with D2AE-CA as an identifier just above the starter.  The came with four barrel heads and carburetor. On the corner of the heads there is a raised 4 indicating they are CJ heads. There may or may not be a raised dot next to the 4. It means nothing but I always say it just tells us they were cast on humpday. These engines made their bones on racetracks in NASCAR. If the engines are original and untouched, the valves are two piece and when they fail by snapping apart, kiss the engine goodbye. My car has a 400 that has maybe 600 miles on a fresh build but the builder is unknown and the guy I bought the car from won't give me the shop name where he bought engine. So I don't rev too high or hard for fear of dropping a valve. 

   Your blue car probably has been rebuilt. Ask the seller, if you can, whether or not it was done over and ask the builder about the valves if it has new valves.  I started my car yesterday for the first time in nearly a month just to get it nice and hot. Cannot wait for springtime. 

How about some engine pics of both? Your paint looks similar. Wink


Edited by handsofstone - 19-February-2021 at 8:21AM
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There is an excellent 351C facebook group with so much info your head will spin. And when the experts here on the board get time to post, any question you have will get an answer. I am by no means an expert on anything but after getting my car, the knowledge from trade school has been slowly returning and saved me thousands in labor costs. I hope one day you can get your family ride restored. I think it would mean more to me in a personal sense. 
  I will shut up now. Lol
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...

edit, I didn't know it had been disproved. I had never heard of the little dot until recently.


Edited by 72 RS 351 - 19-February-2021 at 10:12AM
Don
73 Ranchero "Sport 72 front end", floor shift/console, planning EFI 7000+ rpm 351-4V &4R70W
73 Ranchero GT 351C-4V &4R70W for sale later.
92 Lincoln Mark VII SE GTC, OBDII 347/4R70W
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Originally posted by 72 RS 351 72 RS 351 wrote:

Originally posted by handsofstone handsofstone wrote:

...
On the corner of the heads there is a raised 4 indicating they are CJ heads. There may or may not be a raised dot next to the 4. It means nothing but I always say it just tells us they were cast on humpday.
...


That dot next to the 4, I read it means the heads have open chambers. Supposedly without the dot, it means closed chamber heads.

I don't recall a dot on either of my two sets of open chamber heads. I still have a pair of closed chamber heads, plus those on my 73 Ranchero should be also.
That has been disproven. I am just going by what Tim Halstead and many others have espoused. They can be either or, like 4-bolt mains.
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Very nice Torinos and great story.  I also own my Dad' Torino, his former pride and joy, that he bought new and I grew up with as well.  

The 351C-4V (Cobra-Jet) engine in 1972 was the most powerful engine option.  It was Ford's only real high performance engine offered for that year.  While there was a 429 engine option, it was a lo-po version with less power.  For that reason the Q-codes are often considered the most desirable engines for a 1972 Torino by many.  In comparison to the 351C-2V engine (H-code). they had more than just a carburetor upgrade.  The biggest change was the heads with much larger ports on the 4V engine compared to the 2V engines.  The comapred to a 351C-2V the 351 CJ high-performance engine included a different intake manifold,  a 270/290 degree hydraulic cam cam with  0.481/0.490 inches of lift, upgraded valve springs and dampers, a 750-CFM spread-bore 4300-D Motorcraft carburetor, dual-point distributor (with four-speed manual transmissions only), and four-bolt main bearing caps. All that said, don't get too excited, in stock form they put out 248 SAE net hp.  Good enough for mid-15 sec 1/4 mile times in 1972.  That said, it is pretty easy to wake the engine up.

If you check our out technical articles and reference section of the forum we have tons of info to decode and learn about these cars.  This includes VIN decoders and body tag decoders.  There is also some 351C engine info, including links to expert George Pence's articles on how to wake up a Q-Code engine.
Vince

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Does the A/C in big blue work?
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  Your Dad's car has more to it than a lot of cars people are restoring. After you have been here a while, I am betting you will start dreaming about driving it. How about interior pice when you stop pinching yourself and reality of owning these machines gets blood pressure back to normal.

LOL
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I love the blue color! Both are great cars to own! Thanks for sharing
Dan

1970 Ford Torino hardtop - 351C 4V - FMX - 9" 3.89 TrueTrac
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I was told it didn't.  I have the AC for the yellow one, it's just in the trunk Tongue.  I know the blue one was rebuilt a few years back so I'll check with the seller regarding the valves.

Anyone have any idea what a fair value on the yellow one might be?  While I would love to keep it, it also takes up a lot of room and as previously stated my technical abilities are quite low.
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   Value seems to be all over the place. More money if it runs for sure. Tough to put a number on it without lots of pictures of the vehicle. The fact that it is a one owner ride helps too. Lots of people are always on the lookout for a deal. Look at some of the 72s on the facebook groups and what they are selling for. 
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Good call, it doesn't run currently, but I do know it's on it's third engine.  I'll do some looking.  Here's a more detailed album showing some of the rough spots.
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