The Ford Torino Page Homepage
Forum Home Forum Home > Model Specific Forum > 1972-1976 Ford and Mercury
  New Posts New Posts RSS Feed - Holley Sniper EFI in my 73
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login

Holley Sniper EFI in my 73

 Post Reply Post Reply Page  12>
Author
Message
geno8769 View Drop Down
Member
Member
Avatar

Joined: 28-December-2007
Location: Louisiana
Status: Offline
Points: 98
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote geno8769 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Holley Sniper EFI in my 73
    Posted: 23-September-2017 at 11:10PM
Continuing Saga of My Holley Sniper EFI install. 




Take a look at my video's to date .

1973 GTS "Q" Motor
2013 F150 CC 5.0 4x4 XLT

https://www.youtube.com/user/geno8769
Back to Top
GranTorinoMan View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: 14-August-2005
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 909
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GranTorinoMan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-September-2017 at 7:28AM
I was wondering if you established your peak engine HP / Torque numbers before your EFI install? It would be interesting to see what power gains you achieve after its dialed in.

Edited by GranTorinoMan - 24-September-2017 at 3:18PM
Back to Top
geno8769 View Drop Down
Member
Member
Avatar

Joined: 28-December-2007
Location: Louisiana
Status: Offline
Points: 98
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote geno8769 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-September-2017 at 5:07AM
I didnt. But most of the reviews that I read said they made almost the same horsepower. You just get a bunch of added benefits with it..


1973 GTS "Q" Motor
2013 F150 CC 5.0 4x4 XLT

https://www.youtube.com/user/geno8769
Back to Top
geno8769 View Drop Down
Member
Member
Avatar

Joined: 28-December-2007
Location: Louisiana
Status: Offline
Points: 98
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote geno8769 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-September-2017 at 8:04AM
Next video....

 




Edited by 72FordGTS - 04-December-2017 at 8:30AM
1973 GTS "Q" Motor
2013 F150 CC 5.0 4x4 XLT

https://www.youtube.com/user/geno8769
Back to Top
GranTorinoMan View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: 14-August-2005
Location: Canada
Status: Offline
Points: 909
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GranTorinoMan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-December-2017 at 4:51AM
The effort to install EFI is great but as you say the benefits is the payoff, especially if you don't want the smell of gas on you. My brother was a big Quadrajet carburetor fan and he really knew how to dial them in. What I didn't like was the smell of gas and carb cleaner spray around him and his work bench. 
Back to Top
72GTS351CJ View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: 30-November-2010
Location: NY
Status: Offline
Points: 958
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 72GTS351CJ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-December-2017 at 12:42PM
Last I looked they were in the 2000 dollar range. Now at 1200 or so they have my attention. Reviews are outstanding !! Installations looks very easy. I might be on the phone with Summit Racing real soon
72GTS Clint Eastwood Special                                     
Back to Top
havanariviera View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 24-August-2015
Location: Pennsylvania
Status: Offline
Points: 169
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote havanariviera Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-December-2017 at 1:28PM
My 72 had a brand new FAST EZ EFI professionally installed shortly before I got it. Based on the receipt provided, it was $2,500 at the time for the kit, with a two day install that cost an additional $2,000. I liked the concept initially; dependable start, smooth idle, better mileage, modern, self-tuning, digital tach, etc. All sounds great, and worked well - until it didn't. Even when installed properly, the sensors can fail, the self-tuning feature on the screen can get corrupted, go blue and freeze (like any computer), and so on. If there is excess emission from some unrelated cause, or exhaust that's outside of the specified range - eventually, (and without warning) it could foul out the sensor. When that happens, there is absolutely nothing you can do to get the car going again, no way to override. My car was towed twice in three years, both times were because of failed EFI. Had a different mechanic evaluate it, retune it, seemed to work for 6 months before it failed again. FAST tried to troubleshoot it multiple times, sent out an entirely new kit, and it failed too. Needless to say, my experience with EFI has created a skeptic in me. My mechanic put a Holley 625 carb on in it's place and I haven't looked back. Something to keep in mind, especially if traveling long distance. If the carb has issues, a mallet and a screwdriver will probably help it along just enough so you can nurse it back home for a proper repair. In contrast, if an EFI component fails, you're stuck. That's my two cents; again - this was a FAST EZ EFI, but as I look at it now - the car was born with a carb, and there are two many variables that have to all work together seamlessly (at all times, for the duration of the system's presence) to be assured of reliability. 
Back to Top
72GTS351CJ View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: 30-November-2010
Location: NY
Status: Offline
Points: 958
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 72GTS351CJ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-December-2017 at 1:44PM
Thanks for chiming in. Maybe I'll sit back and wait a bit to see some reviews a year from now. Don't like being stranded helpless
72GTS Clint Eastwood Special                                     
Back to Top
ilyes View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: 09-January-2010
Location: Philadelphia PA
Status: Offline
Points: 3606
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ilyes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-December-2017 at 3:04PM
Installed one a few weeks ago. I like it better than fast, hands down. The interface is better than fast and fitech, though a bit harder to set up the parameters the first time. The harness bulk is about the same size as the Fast, Fitech is a lot let.

Now, after driving all 3, I like the fitech and Holley the most. Fast is inconsistent on hot starts, especially on lower vacuum engine.
Back to Top
californiajohnny View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: 05-October-2013
Location: winlock, wa
Status: Offline
Points: 8208
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote californiajohnny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-December-2017 at 4:39PM
Originally posted by havanariviera havanariviera wrote:

My 72 had a brand new FAST EZ EFI professionally installed shortly before I got it. Based on the receipt provided, it was $2,500 at the time for the kit, with a two day install that cost an additional $2,000. I liked the concept initially; dependable start, smooth idle, better mileage, modern, self-tuning, digital tach, etc. All sounds great, and worked well - until it didn't. Even when installed properly, the sensors can fail, the self-tuning feature on the screen can get corrupted, go blue and freeze (like any computer), and so on. If there is excess emission from some unrelated cause, or exhaust that's outside of the specified range - eventually, (and without warning) it could foul out the sensor. When that happens, there is absolutely nothing you can do to get the car going again, no way to override. My car was towed twice in three years, both times were because of failed EFI. Had a different mechanic evaluate it, retune it, seemed to work for 6 months before it failed again. FAST tried to troubleshoot it multiple times, sent out an entirely new kit, and it failed too. Needless to say, my experience with EFI has created a skeptic in me. My mechanic put a Holley 625 carb on in it's place and I haven't looked back. Something to keep in mind, especially if traveling long distance. If the carb has issues, a mallet and a screwdriver will probably help it along just enough so you can nurse it back home for a proper repair. In contrast, if an EFI component fails, you're stuck. That's my two cents; again - this was a FAST EZ EFI, but as I look at it now - the car was born with a carb, and there are two many variables that have to all work together seamlessly (at all times, for the duration of the system's presence) to be assured of reliability. 
THIS^^^^ that's exactly why i prefer carbs and older cars!!!!
 had an issue with my blazer and the EFI, got tired of throwing parts and money at it! put a edelbrock intake and holley carb on it with an older stand along HEI!!! no more issues!!!!Wink
JOHN
74 GRAN TORINO S&H CLONE
74 CORVETTE COUPE CUSTOM
90 S10 BLAZER 4X4 LIFTED
77 CELICA CUSTOM
75 V8 MONZA SUPERCHARGED
79 COURIER VERT. SLAMMED
75 VEGA V6 5 SPD
70 CHEV C10 P/U
Back to Top
aquartlow View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: 19-December-2011
Location: Summerfield, Fl
Status: Offline
Points: 1609
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote aquartlow Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-December-2017 at 12:54AM
Originally posted by californiajohnny californiajohnny wrote:

Originally posted by havanariviera havanariviera wrote:

My 72 had a brand new FAST EZ EFI professionally installed shortly before I got it. Based on the receipt provided, it was $2,500 at the time for the kit, with a two day install that cost an additional $2,000. I liked the concept initially; dependable start, smooth idle, better mileage, modern, self-tuning, digital tach, etc. All sounds great, and worked well - until it didn't. Even when installed properly, the sensors can fail, the self-tuning feature on the screen can get corrupted, go blue and freeze (like any computer), and so on. If there is excess emission from some unrelated cause, or exhaust that's outside of the specified range - eventually, (and without warning) it could foul out the sensor. When that happens, there is absolutely nothing you can do to get the car going again, no way to override. My car was towed twice in three years, both times were because of failed EFI. Had a different mechanic evaluate it, retune it, seemed to work for 6 months before it failed again. FAST tried to troubleshoot it multiple times, sent out an entirely new kit, and it failed too. Needless to say, my experience with EFI has created a skeptic in me. My mechanic put a Holley 625 carb on in it's place and I haven't looked back. Something to keep in mind, especially if traveling long distance. If the carb has issues, a mallet and a screwdriver will probably help it along just enough so you can nurse it back home for a proper repair. In contrast, if an EFI component fails, you're stuck. That's my two cents; again - this was a FAST EZ EFI, but as I look at it now - the car was born with a carb, and there are two many variables that have to all work together seamlessly (at all times, for the duration of the system's presence) to be assured of reliability. 
THIS^^^^ that's exactly why i prefer carbs and older cars!!!!
 had an issue with my blazer and the EFI, got tired of throwing parts and money at it! put a edelbrock intake and holley carb on it with an older stand along HEI!!! no more issues!!!!Wink
X3 for me as well. I REALLY wanted to do EFI for a long while on my ride, ever since the 1st Holley Pro-jection units came out about 25 years ago. Those were very unreliable for whatever reasons, either sensor, software or installation. Now with the fairly affordable new crop of self tuning EFI in the recent years the urge to change-over was even greater, but I again procrastinated and thus just installed a wideband which allows me to get my Holley carbs tuned for my engine's needs. The results are good(maybe not to the extent of EFI) and can be tuned and/or fixed by me on the side of the road if the need arises. The self learning EFI systems are(on paper) great, but potential issues arise by either failures with the units, sensors, installation short-falls or a combination of all these and also unseen, overlooked or unfathomable factors.
  Another issue that I have heard/read about that sorta surprised me is simply an older engine that uses umbrella valve seals instead of the more modern positive control valve seals, these older umbrella seals allow a bit of oil to bypass the valve stems and screws with the tuning and/or an O2 sensor's accuracy/longevity. I wonder if this situation is being brought to a potential customer's attention, before the product is bought. I realize this isn't the fault of the self learning EFI units, but it should be presented in the installation discussion to allow more a positive experience and/or longer lasting benefits.  
  I seriously hope the OP gets his Holley Sniper system figured out and it does run well for him, so he can reap the benefits for years to come.  
www.supermotors.net/22468
Yeah, It's a Hybrid...It burns gas and tires.

No matter how good she looks, somebody, somewhere, is tired of her sh*t.

Beauty is skin deep, ugliness goes clear to the bone.
Back to Top
havanariviera View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 24-August-2015
Location: Pennsylvania
Status: Offline
Points: 169
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote havanariviera Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-December-2017 at 2:15AM
Agreed, it just seems to me (I can't work on cars, so I have all my work professionally done) that unless the old car is extremely tight in every way possible, issues are inevitable. As mentioned in the post above, "older umbrella seals allow a bit of oil to bypass valve stems and screws" and potentially interfere with self-tuning, sensors, etc. This is a perfect example in my case of why the EFI would operate without issue for months at a time, and then fail without warning. In one of the situations, I drove 50 miles with no symptoms; parked for 5 minutes to go in and get a soda at a convenience store, came out and got nothing. It was trying to turn over, but just wasn't getting any fuel/air mixture to start back up. When a carb is going bad or need to be retuned, rebuilt - you'd likely experience a rough idle or some other symptom that indicates you need to address it. With the FAST EZ EFI, like I said - fine one minute, left me stranded the next minute. The other oddity is that the screen would indicate errors when none were present, you'd have to consult the manual or call FAST to understand, address, and clear the error code. The concept of self tuning does sound good on paper, but it's basing the actions on the conditions present as gleaned from the sensors. One day it would be running so rich, there would be soot coming out of the tailpipes, and without manual adjusting it on the touch screen, I'd keep driving so the system could "learn" - you're encouraged to do that. So then it would self adjust, and the next day I'd be getting lean pop any time I accelerated. The other thing as I alluded in my post, if you're out and something fails on the carb or other related component, you can probably stop in an auto parts store or even a garage and get the minimal parts needed or a quick repair that will get you home. With EFI, there is no such thing as stopping into the nearest Autozone and buying a new, compatible O2 sensor if it were to fail and you're 50 miles from home. For me, this is less of a critique of the FAST system, and more on bolt on EFI in general. I'm sure there are plenty of guys who have had good luck and no issues. For my car, it just wasn't a match and I wasn't going to continue to pour money into a system that I had no faith in. With the Holley 625 and the 4V Edelbrock intake, the car runs great - the idle is just as smooth as EFI, never runs rich, no lean pop - the only thing missing is better gas mileage. But I'll pay extra fuel costs to avoid the risk of running an unreliable EFI setup that has the potential (twice demonstrated in my case) of leaving me stranded with no options other than a tow.
Back to Top
72FordGTS View Drop Down
Admin Group
Admin Group
Avatar

Joined: 06-September-2005
Location: Ontario, Canada
Status: Online
Points: 1747
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 72FordGTS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-December-2017 at 8:34AM
Originally posted by geno8769 geno8769 wrote:

Next video....

 
Thanks for sharing these videos. They are a great resource for the forum.
Originally posted by ilyes ilyes wrote:

Installed one a few weeks ago. I like it better than fast, hands down. The interface is better than fast and fitech, though a bit harder to set up the parameters the first time. The harness bulk is about the same size as the Fast, Fitech is a lot let.

Now, after driving all 3, I like the fitech and Holley the most. Fast is inconsistent on hot starts, especially on lower vacuum engine.
 
Why did you end up changing the FI system?  Last time I remember you were installing the FiTech system on you car. 
Vince

1972 Ford GTS Sportsroof - Survivor, One Family car
Back to Top
72FordGTS View Drop Down
Admin Group
Admin Group
Avatar

Joined: 06-September-2005
Location: Ontario, Canada
Status: Online
Points: 1747
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 72FordGTS Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-December-2017 at 8:40AM

I like the idea of Fuel injection, but I have several reasons for probably never installing it on my Torino.  First, I like the idea of an old car having old technology.  It's nice to have simple mechanical parts that can be tuned and fixed easily.  Plus I want to keep my car appearing stockish.

Second, the cost of the systems has come done, but they are still very pricey, once you figure in the fuel system mods that are also required.  And me living north of the border, I always have to live with higher prices in general.
 
Third, while OEM fuel injection is dead nuts reliable, I am question the reliability of aftermarket systems.  And while you can have go to any parts store to get parts for your 25 year old FI truck, that probably won't happen for these aftermarket systems. 
 
But I am glad they keep coming down in price and improving with time.  I may never put on my Torino, but I could foresee using an FI system on another project down the road.
Vince

1972 Ford GTS Sportsroof - Survivor, One Family car
Back to Top
ilyes View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: 09-January-2010
Location: Philadelphia PA
Status: Offline
Points: 3606
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ilyes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-December-2017 at 12:19PM
I still have the Fitech in my car, and don't plan on changing it unless I score a tunne ram, then I'd put 2 of them on top. I've installed a lot of these EFI at work, so I just want to share what I like/dislike about them.
Back to Top
72GTS351CJ View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: 30-November-2010
Location: NY
Status: Offline
Points: 958
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 72GTS351CJ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-December-2017 at 12:31PM
How about a few pics
72GTS Clint Eastwood Special                                     
Back to Top
havanariviera View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 24-August-2015
Location: Pennsylvania
Status: Offline
Points: 169
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote havanariviera Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-December-2017 at 1:09PM
Back to Top
havanariviera View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 24-August-2015
Location: Pennsylvania
Status: Offline
Points: 169
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote havanariviera Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-December-2017 at 1:10PM
Back to Top
havanariviera View Drop Down
Member
Member


Joined: 24-August-2015
Location: Pennsylvania
Status: Offline
Points: 169
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote havanariviera Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-December-2017 at 1:11PM
For what it's worth, here are a couple shots of when the FAST EZ EFI was installed; aesthetically, it didn't look bad - the throttle body setup almost looked like it belonged. It just wasn't meant to be for me.
Back to Top
72GTS351CJ View Drop Down
Senior Member
Senior Member
Avatar

Joined: 30-November-2010
Location: NY
Status: Offline
Points: 958
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote 72GTS351CJ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-December-2017 at 2:16PM
Looks like a nice clean installation. What a shame it's not reliable.... Geno.. I loved your video. Let us know how it runs
72GTS Clint Eastwood Special                                     
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  12>
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 11.10
Copyright ©2001-2017 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.078 seconds.