INFO: Tubular Upper Control Arms |
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M Casey Stock
Senior Member Joined: 02-September-2015 Location: Meridian MS Status: Offline Points: 233 |
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Okay, so you are saying that the same arm that fits the Maverick ( the only ford car that Global West offers upper arms for in years that would include the mid to upper 70's) will be a direct fit for a 72-76 Gran Torino? If so, then great! I still have no problems with my current caster settings, so that is still not a draw for me, BUT! These things are at least loaded with all new bushings, ball joint and thru-shaft with grease fittings for the bushings, ready to bolt on. They are still a little pricey for just a pair of uppers, but the best deal I've seen so far. Here is a link to this product. http://www.globalwest.net/1970-77maverick.html |
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1975 Gran Torino, Copperhead
http://forum.grantorinosport.org/75-gran-torino-soft-restoration-copper-head_topic15137_post169060.html?KW=#169060 |
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BackInBlack
Senior Member Joined: 11-January-2011 Location: Virginia Status: Offline Points: 1013 |
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Edited: Removed post...TMI everything already mentioned already.
Edited by BackInBlack - 07-June-2017 at 4:08AM |
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-John
1973 GTS |
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mtburger
Senior Member Joined: 24-November-2008 Location: Abington, MA Status: Offline Points: 355 |
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Wow, sorry for not clarifying.
As stated the Global West pieces are only good for the UNIT BODY shock tower drag strut cars. For Torino, Montego, & Rancheros the application would be 1968 through 1971, or pre 1972. The post 1972 applications are Mustang, Cougar, Granada, Monarch, Maverick, and Comet, with 1978 being the last year of production for the UNIT BODY shock tower drag strut cars. 1979 replaced those platforms with the introduction of the FOX bodied Fairmont, Zephyr, Granada, Mustang, Capri, Cougar, & Thunderbird. The point I was trying to make is that even for Ford or Mercury applications that have a larger number of applicable models, with a much longer production run, the control arms are still more than $550.00 per set. Mike H. Edited by mtburger - 07-June-2017 at 3:50AM |
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BackInBlack
Senior Member Joined: 11-January-2011 Location: Virginia Status: Offline Points: 1013 |
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Sorry...no offense intended. Not having much luck lately with email; sometimes comes across the wrong way. I'll delete my other post. It seemed there was some confusion there and I was trying to clarify. Cheers.
Lately it seems that I can't even write emails that aren't taken the wrong way. I'm a Vulcan; can't help it. Edited by BackInBlack - 07-June-2017 at 4:11AM |
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-John
1973 GTS |
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M Casey Stock
Senior Member Joined: 02-September-2015 Location: Meridian MS Status: Offline Points: 233 |
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I'm right there with you on that Buddy! |
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1975 Gran Torino, Copperhead
http://forum.grantorinosport.org/75-gran-torino-soft-restoration-copper-head_topic15137_post169060.html?KW=#169060 |
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mtburger
Senior Member Joined: 24-November-2008 Location: Abington, MA Status: Offline Points: 355 |
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No issues here.
The Wow, was for me not being more specific and seeing how easy it is to head down the Yellow Brick Road. Mike H. |
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M Casey Stock
Senior Member Joined: 02-September-2015 Location: Meridian MS Status: Offline Points: 233 |
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This is the part that got my attention. I did not think they looked like they would fit (different angles and width) That's why I asked for clarification to gain certainty. No worries here, I wasn't about to place an order based on one comment. I do my homework, my money comes by too hard to waste. I do hate that my gut feeling was correct |
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1975 Gran Torino, Copperhead
http://forum.grantorinosport.org/75-gran-torino-soft-restoration-copper-head_topic15137_post169060.html?KW=#169060 |
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BackInBlack
Senior Member Joined: 11-January-2011 Location: Virginia Status: Offline Points: 1013 |
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For me...in for a penny, in for a pound. At times I self reflect and think I'm nuts for spending this on this car. Its irrational except I like the car and plan to keep it. Then I think about how cool it will be to roll up to a car show and be the only bad azz 72+ Torino sitting there. These are great platforms with a lot of potential that has not been discovered yet by the masses at Barrett Jackson. I remember buying my 71 Plymouth Cuda in high school for $400 bucks...now look at their costs. Same will happen with this generation Ford in time to a lesser extent.
I just decided. Either do it...or get rid of it. Its pricey but given the trade-offs I just bought it and moved on. Now its behind me and now tackling other issues. I'm doing other mods like using extended ball joints, etc to accompany these a-arms and the strut bushings. I'm trying to get teh front to feel lighter and have a quicker response with more modern front suspension geometry. |
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-John
1973 GTS |
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madmaxtorino
Moderator Group Zombie Killing Training Instructor Joined: 04-August-2010 Location: Lawrenceburg Tn Status: Offline Points: 971 |
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hotchkis is making them now but they are 600 loaded.
Edited by madmaxtorino - 07-June-2017 at 4:23PM |
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Allan
Revelation 6:8 When there is no more room in Hell, the dead will walk the Earth. |
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Nuggets
Senior Member Joined: 07-November-2014 Location: UK Status: Offline Points: 869 |
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They look better than the current ones
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Barnaby
429 powered 73 Stripper.....no comfort, just noise! |
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72FordGTS
Admin Group GTS.org Admin Joined: 06-September-2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Status: Offline Points: 5846 |
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Nice, so they finally start to produce Leno's arms, albeit on a limited basis! I like the fact that these correct the geometry, but they are pricey! Note that they also have lower arms and strut rods. I am not sure if all will swap over to our Torino though.
Edited by 72FordGTS - 08-June-2017 at 1:23AM |
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Vince
1972 Ford GTS Sportsroof - Survivor, One Family car GTS.org Admin |
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Nuggets
Senior Member Joined: 07-November-2014 Location: UK Status: Offline Points: 869 |
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I reckon thats a little lie they're telling
they'll probably be more available than they're letting on but "introductory" just means they'll get a few quick sales in a panic buy if any Galaxie owners see them and they're building a racer
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Barnaby
429 powered 73 Stripper.....no comfort, just noise! |
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BackInBlack
Senior Member Joined: 11-January-2011 Location: Virginia Status: Offline Points: 1013 |
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This is a good sign...means the industry is starting to recognize these cars. These look great! They correct 2 problems; the positive caster and the negative camber gain. These look like they will work with teh stock spindles without any extra stuff. These a-arms appear to have more arc on the arm to raise the upper a-arm inclination angle without using extended ball joints to lengthen the spindle. Honestly, these look better and correct the geometry issues vs the Little shop A-arms. Little shop's are nice but they only increase the positive caster by 4 degrees. Which is why I'm using Howe Racing upper extended ball joints to help correct the camber gain coupled with the Little Ship upper a-arms. I would like a better lower arm...still haven't found anything (aside from just welding/boxing the stock lower arm). Also, still looking for a front 1 3/8" sway bar option. Hotchkis has a 1 3/8" bar for Galaxy...will it fit the Torino? Torino sway bars were used on the 65 Galaxy, but can the Galaxy sway bar be used on the Torino? Edited by BackInBlack - 08-June-2017 at 7:29AM |
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-John
1973 GTS |
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Nuggets
Senior Member Joined: 07-November-2014 Location: UK Status: Offline Points: 869 |
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So the the Hotchkis arms will fit a 73 then?
I was putting off buying these til last but it turns out I could use the clearance for the turbo headers.....mocked up today and I can make the pipes much shorter if I remove the big pressed stiffener nearest the block |
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Barnaby
429 powered 73 Stripper.....no comfort, just noise! |
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BackInBlack
Senior Member Joined: 11-January-2011 Location: Virginia Status: Offline Points: 1013 |
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I dont know for certain...I did take detailed measurements of the galaxy spindles vs the torino. They are compatible. However, I didn't write down anything on the a-arms for comparison
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-John
1973 GTS |
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Big Bird
Senior Member Joined: 25-August-2013 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 4194 |
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Spindles/knee assemblies are interchangeable 65-78 fullsize into the Torino chassis.
Knee assembly includes upper, lower control arms, spindles and (Supposedly) strut rods. Some Lower control arms have different spring pockets, so swp in pairs if they don't match or your car won't sit level. Don't know anyone who actually swapped the struts as the big bolt/bushing combo is a bear to get apart. When we were putting Torino Disc brakes into 65-67 Galaxies, we swapped the control arms because the ball joints looked "different" (bolt-in vs. press-in) and the Torino parts were fairly new, Galaxies typically had 100k or more miles.
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"What we do in full frontal view, is more honest than your cleaned-up mind."
Randy 1979 T-Bird 2005 F-150 STX RCSB 4.6, 3.55 LSD How the Heck does a REGULAR CAB SHORTBED weigh over 5200 pounds? |
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72FordGTS
Admin Group GTS.org Admin Joined: 06-September-2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Status: Offline Points: 5846 |
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I don't have the parts catalog with me know, but IIRC, the same part number was used on the upper arms from for the 1965+ Fords as the 1972 Torinos (early). The 1972 late - 1976 Torino arm received the larger bushings, but are otherwise the same. I can't remember on the lower arms, if Randy has done this swaping, it sounds like they are the same. I'd probably stick with the Torino strut rods to be on the safe side.
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Vince
1972 Ford GTS Sportsroof - Survivor, One Family car GTS.org Admin |
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Nuggets
Senior Member Joined: 07-November-2014 Location: UK Status: Offline Points: 869 |
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Looks like I might have to buy those then!
I'd rather spend the extra $100 on them vs little shop if they fit. It's either this or mutilate the chassis and bring the pipes down rather than up.... |
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Barnaby
429 powered 73 Stripper.....no comfort, just noise! |
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BackInBlack
Senior Member Joined: 11-January-2011 Location: Virginia Status: Offline Points: 1013 |
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Thats great info! I didn't realize these parts were used on so many full-size models.
What about the Galaxy sway bar...will it fit on a Torino? Torino is really wide (63" track width). I think I measured 59" eye to eye on the Torino sway bar and it looks like the Galaxy is 58" The reason I'm asking is that I want to upsize the front sway bar to 13/8" I'm wondering if I can simply install the Hotchkiss Galaxy sway bar on my Torino. |
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-John
1973 GTS |
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Nuggets
Senior Member Joined: 07-November-2014 Location: UK Status: Offline Points: 869 |
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I'm sure summit sell one that size for a Tornio
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Barnaby
429 powered 73 Stripper.....no comfort, just noise! |
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BackInBlack
Senior Member Joined: 11-January-2011 Location: Virginia Status: Offline Points: 1013 |
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Nope...I've looked into Nearly all fords chevy pontiac...etc.
I can't find anything that will work on a Torino that is larger than the standard Addco 1 1/8" front sway bar. What makes it so difficult is that these Fords have a very wide track width as compared to other cars. Chevy is pretty standard ...if my memory serves me...around 60" Torino is 63"...more like a truck. This means the sway bar has to be wider. The only option I found if you want more than 1 1/8" front bar is to custom install a splined sway bar. I would rather find one that will bolt on... |
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-John
1973 GTS |
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Power Surge
Senior Member Joined: 06-March-2016 Location: Palm Coast, FL Status: Offline Points: 542 |
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I've been looking too, for the Ranchero, and came up with the same results. Might go splined. |
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Sal Mennella
73 GTS 351 CJ 75 Cougar XR7 73 Ranchero - 5.0 Coyote swap - in progress Past Torinos - 72 Gran Torino, 75 Gran Torino, 75 Elite |
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Big Bird
Senior Member Joined: 25-August-2013 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 4194 |
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Track width on torino is supposedly same as the earlier fullsize (65-68). Never personally measured it.
Torino frame dimensions are so close to Panther chassis as well, I would think you could adapt it's bars. We always got parts for the brake upgrade at a you-pull-it yard and rather than fight with the Strut rod's big bolt, we would shear the two little bolts that hold it to the LCA.
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"What we do in full frontal view, is more honest than your cleaned-up mind."
Randy 1979 T-Bird 2005 F-150 STX RCSB 4.6, 3.55 LSD How the Heck does a REGULAR CAB SHORTBED weigh over 5200 pounds? |
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Nuggets
Senior Member Joined: 07-November-2014 Location: UK Status: Offline Points: 869 |
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I would think the best option might be to find something that'll bolt up to the existing points if widened, then weld in some chromoly tubing to widen it?
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Barnaby
429 powered 73 Stripper.....no comfort, just noise! |
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californiajohnny
Moderator Group Joined: 05-October-2013 Location: winlock, wa Status: Offline Points: 14609 |
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can't find a bigger bar? or hate to spend the $$$? do what i did on my celica (and my ford courier too) with a little ingenuity and fab work... double stack two stock bars
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JOHN
74 GRAN TORINO S&H CLONE 74 VETTE CUSTOM 90 S10 BLAZER 4X4 LIFTED 77 CELICA CUSTOM 75 V8 MONZA SUPERCHARGED 79 COURIER VERT. SLAMMED 75 VEGA V6 5 SPD 70 CHEV C10 P/U 68 MUSTANG FB CONVERSION |
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72FordGTS
Admin Group GTS.org Admin Joined: 06-September-2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Status: Offline Points: 5846 |
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John, I can check the parts catalog later to see if the bars are interchangeable. I thought that they wouldn't swap, going by memory.
Why do you want to go so big in the front? Personally I'd like to find a bigger than 7/8's rear bar before I upgraded the front.
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Vince
1972 Ford GTS Sportsroof - Survivor, One Family car GTS.org Admin |
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BackInBlack
Senior Member Joined: 11-January-2011 Location: Virginia Status: Offline Points: 1013 |
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Every sway bar I've looked at to "adapt" has not worked out because of the overall width of the mounting points on our torino's. If you dont land near the same realative mounting points with the "new" bar it causes other interference problems. That said...I measure stock eye-to-eye front sway bar at 49 1/4", arm length ~12", frame mounts speration at ~38 1/2". I haven't found anything that will come close. I did find some more modern bars say from a 2002 camaro or late model charger but the mounting are completely different where they dont use the same stud through an eye on the bar end mounting configuration.
EDIT If my memory serves me...I think the Galaxy bars are 48" eye-to-eye center which is to far off to be able to reuse on a Torino. I keep coming back to a custom splined setup for the front. I always felt teh body plows to much in the turns...I want to control the body roll more to help limit the suspension range under compression to optimize the camber gain. If you add to much rear bar it will oversteer like crazy...I've already tested this with bigger rear bar and stiffer rear springs. That backend breaks loose way to easy around a corner. Trying to keep the balance front to rear I wanted to control it more with the front bar rather than the rear bar. I've already put the 7/8 rear bar on...and I feel it helped overall but it made the back end break loose quickly relative to the overall body roll. Thats why I'm thinking a good overall combination would be a 1 3/8" front with the 7/8" rear. If you look at what some suspension kits offered for chevelles (The are not exact but pretty close in size/weight to our car. I did a analytical comparison via spreadsheet between chevelle/torino for comparison between springs/bars and basic suspension geometry) they tend to be in this ballpark for performance street setups. Oh...also regarding cutting welding up sway bars. I dont think that it would be a good idea to do that because they are made from spring steel. Heating it up would wreck the properties of the steel. Sway bars are also (or should be) heat treated. Any heat applied would ruin them. Double up sway bar! didn't think of that. How did that work? Edited by BackInBlack - 22-June-2017 at 8:58AM |
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-John
1973 GTS |
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Big Bird
Senior Member Joined: 25-August-2013 Location: New York Status: Offline Points: 4194 |
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So, welding up the cracks in the sway bar on my truck ("Quality" G. M.) was a bad idea???
Some considerations for a sway bar:
Width hole-to-hole Mounting location "arm" length vertical offset from mounting location to hole location Edited by Big Bird - 22-June-2017 at 10:57AM |
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"What we do in full frontal view, is more honest than your cleaned-up mind."
Randy 1979 T-Bird 2005 F-150 STX RCSB 4.6, 3.55 LSD How the Heck does a REGULAR CAB SHORTBED weigh over 5200 pounds? |
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BackInBlack
Senior Member Joined: 11-January-2011 Location: Virginia Status: Offline Points: 1013 |
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I'm prolly overthinking it...Analysis paralysis...
I just need to finish it and drive it...see where I'm at then adjust.
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-John
1973 GTS |
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72FordGTS
Admin Group GTS.org Admin Joined: 06-September-2005 Location: Ontario, Canada Status: Offline Points: 5846 |
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John are you still planning on using CVPI springs in the front? If so, I'd recommend trying the car with those springs and a 1 1/8 bar first before you go to all the work of a custom splined bar. Once you get your springs then I'd play with the bars if you need too. With the heavy front Springs in my car in had no issues with oversteer unless I induced it even with the heavier rear springs. I since soften my rear springs for ride and because it was skipping one rough pavement. The car is very flat in the front with the CVPI springs.
Edited by 72FordGTS - 22-June-2017 at 3:33PM |
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Vince
1972 Ford GTS Sportsroof - Survivor, One Family car GTS.org Admin |
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