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which oil pump and timin chain set?

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MrSmog View Drop Down
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    Posted: 07-July-2016 at 8:48PM
Motor is a 1973 351c 2v. I just want a good stock replacement oil pump and pickup. I also want the correct timin chain (chain and both gears) set that will zero the cam back and get rid of the 4 degrees of retard, single row stock replacement type is fine (but not nylon gears obviously). I have searched on here but couldn't find a real clear cut answer. Not lookin to make this complicated but i do realize there is so much mis-information out there that i'd rather be pretty sure which one to get before i order it. thanks


Past 1974 Ranchero GT Q code

Present 1973 Q code formal roof base model Torino with ralleye equpiment package and 4spd.
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mcford View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mcford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-July-2016 at 6:24AM
STOCK MELLING PUMP AND TIMING SET FOR A 70 CLEVLEAND.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MrSmog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-July-2016 at 7:08AM
Originally posted by mcford mcford wrote:

STOCK MELLING PUMP AND TIMING SET FOR A 70 CLEVLEAND.


well yea, but all the timin chain sets say they are for the 70-74 351c, but not all of them are set for zero from what I read on other posts. I was lookin for brands and part numbers from someone who knows exactly the correct ones.


Edited by MrSmog - 08-July-2016 at 7:11AM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mcford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-July-2016 at 7:10AM
Melling M84A and 84AS1 - PUMP AND PICKUP
Melling 3-494SB timing set
sealed power timing set - KT3-494SA2
Sealed Power oil pump and screen - 224-41166 & 224-11143

Mike
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mcford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-July-2016 at 7:16AM
thats what you're going to get unless you go with a 3 position set.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote mcford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-July-2016 at 7:21AM
WHICH IS A CLOYES 9-1121 TRUE ROLLER SET
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MrSmog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-July-2016 at 7:23AM
Thanks. I have heard unless you degree the cam in, the 3 position set can be a crap shoot as far as gettin it on zero, the center slot doesn't always ensure the cam is at zero or so i read. I want to keep this simple but wouldn't mind a little power increase while I am sprucin this engine up a lil bit. Clevelands are all new to me and seems there is a LOT of mis-information out there on them.
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Rockatansky View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rockatansky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-July-2016 at 10:48AM
these 3 crank sprockets are all on the 0 key, all 3 are in a different place
just what I had hangin around, no idea what brand or part number is what
 
 
does Melling or Cloyes list a different timing set for a 1974 351C or a 1979 351M ?
 
FWIW there was thickness change along the way somewhere which may explain different timing set part numbers, here's the Bubba page that confirms different thickness chains & matching sprockets
 
if I was not going to degree in the cam I would start with a good used C8SE-6306-A  crank sprocket to eliminate 1 place Ford did the deed ...
or just use a quality 3 way set on +4
 
Quality? yes there's a big difference in the quality of the chain itself. google ROLON, IWIS & JWIS
 
then you can get into a trick bag with the fuel pump eccentric not fitting under the cover Angry Cry Ouch Shocked Wacko


Edited by Rockatansky - 09-July-2016 at 10:50AM
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MrSmog View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MrSmog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-July-2016 at 1:37PM
like I said, keepin this one simple, just makin an attempt to get it to a zero set instead of the 4 degrees retarded set, thats all. its just a stock 2v and as long as I own it, thats all it will ever be. This is just goin into a car that I am gonna put up for sale, it was a good runnin engine, just want to give myself a little peace of mind when I sell it to someone else. When it comes time to put my car together, i'm tempted to park the cj on a stand and just build me a nice 351w, less confusion and I have already put some hot ones together. They make a better street motor IMO anyways.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rockatansky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-July-2016 at 5:53PM
all the same issues apply to the Windsor as well, and then some
 
keeping it simple the correct thickness stock replacement timing set with a steel cam sprocket should do the job
 
gotta love simple Thumbs Up
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote californiajohnny Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-July-2016 at 6:14PM
Originally posted by Rockatansky Rockatansky wrote:

all the same issues apply to the Windsor as well, and then some
 
keeping it simple the correct thickness stock replacement timing set with a steel cam sprocket should do the job
 
gotta love simple Thumbs Up
really? so poor machining tolerances on the windsor gears too? guess i got lucky on mine the gear drive gears were the same alignment as the stock chain sprocket. yes i opted for the gear drive----for the noise WinkBig smile

JOHN
74 GRAN TORINO S&H CLONE
74 VETTE CUSTOM
90 S10 BLAZER 4X4 LIFTED
77 CELICA CUSTOM
75 V8 MONZA SUPERCHARGED
79 COURIER VERT. SLAMMED
75 VEGA V6 5 SPD
70 CHEV C10 P/U
68 MUSTANG FB CONVERSION
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Rockatansky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-July-2016 at 6:33PM
just aftermarket non-standardization. kinda like the game telephone, get a handful or more companies to make timing gears & how many will be dead nutz identical to the degree? the average Joe just slaps the timing set in & buttons it up, no degreeing necessary & they work, they run better than the whipped out slap chain that came out so Beer everybody's Big smile but if you really want to get into the nitty gritty you might not like what you find
 
I ran a quiet gear drive for a bit, it made just enough noise to sound Dead but there was no chain stretch LOL
 
don't even get started on the numerous variations of small block rocker arms, valve spring retainers & valve tips over the years 


Edited by Rockatansky - 09-July-2016 at 6:37PM
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote MrSmog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-July-2016 at 6:37PM
Originally posted by Rockatansky Rockatansky wrote:

all the same issues apply to the Windsor as well, and then some
 
keeping it simple the correct thickness stock replacement timing set with a steel cam sprocket should do the job
 
gotta love simple Thumbs Up



I never EVER had any problems with the windsors i have put together and I have slapped together some junk pile windsors, sprayed the daylights out of them on nitrous and they never failed. way more aftermarket support for them and a endless supply of donor engines around.

Yes, I could have probably left things alone, but figgered while it was out and easy to get to, why not do a few things.
Past 1974 Ranchero GT Q code

Present 1973 Q code formal roof base model Torino with ralleye equpiment package and 4spd.
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